Events mean nothing now.

[ozymandias]

It's so nice having suit connection, datafiles, relays, request devices, dispatch and radios be fully functioning again with a homemade antenna, isn't it? No. No the fuck it is not. I don't know who brought up this idea and executed it, but there was something not right with them when they planned this. We had a whole event that would disable OCIN. Rebels won that, and OCIN was disabled for about a week or two. Afterwards, thanks to a fucking antenna, the Combine now have all their communications again! Yipee!
There's no point in doing events where rebels win if it's gonna get voided entirely without anyone getting to know about it. The "antenna" wasn't even placed in-server, it was when everyone was offline and it was F2B. A "workshift" managed to fix OCIN with an antenna. The Combine are not THAT fucking strong, they're pretty weak in the games compared to what Willard depicts.

This won't change in V3 at all by the way, as the same management or team that made this decision is staying. There's also the matter of Combine mains knowing that this is wrong, but still doing anything to justify it as they don't want their side to lose. This is like the safe-zones in Hide & Seek.

Just end V2, say "rebels lose yall are fucking stupid" and that'll be much better than this fairytale shit made to fuel peoples egos. What happened yesterday should not have happened at all, and should have been completely voided. Also, no event at all for the antenna bullshit. Great.

I apologise for my aggressiveness in this thread, but this shit needs to fucking stop. It's at its peak dogshit state, and it's GOING TO continue in V3. This is just a spit in the face to any of the rebel players, AND the combine players, as they themselves know this is stupid.

The same management will talk about how V2 is in a horrible state, and how they can't wait for it to be over, but they're the ones making it worse.

 

[Mullet]

Nothing changed after the OCIN tower went down. The effects it once brought are now null and void. The Combine operates as if nothing had changed. The Combine, in some respects, are even more powerful now that it is down. Nothing has been taken into consideration, not manpower issues, not communication issues, not tactical vulnerability.

You are saying this after a short period. Without having spoken to Robert on the matter of TLM, OCIN problems WILL have an impact, but shockingly the fact that the suppression squads surrounding the bunker are a mere twenty minute dropship ride from C24 does mean that communication is manageable.

the ocin blew up...

[PERCEPTION CHECK -- SUCCESS] You feel your blood pressure rising.

 

[RedHotGinger]

Without having spoken to Robert on the matter of TLM, OCIN problems WILL have an impact

It would have been great to have it matter before V2 ended.

 

[Inspector Orlok]

Also curious as to how you found this out from the community, considering there wasn't a feedback thread...

No offence but you're unironically one of the more Combine biased people on the server, dare I say the most Combine biased person. It's very hard to take anything you say seriously when a good portion, if not all, of your experiences stem from you playing OTA.

I love the Combine, I really do, but I'm not some stupid Combine larper who thinks the Combine will never lose. They will lose, and when they do the rebels will rise up and take over. You and a few others have done nothing but prevent this, and for what, the smug satisfaction your side won?

City 24 win and the rebels lose, great now what, we close the server and hope RadX and Robert can cobble together a good enough expo with the Long March.

 

[rae]

It's not that I suspected them as being infiltrators

Oh I did, I knew of two possible infiltrators, just that there wasn't enough time to root them out and actually do anything to them apart from exclude. Because getting an auth to kill them would've taken longer than the bunker server was up for.


Especially because hard evidence is difficult to gather generally, which is the only grounds I'll ever take to PK somebody.

 

[Acheif]

You were so focused on winning you didn’t even consider it wasn’t a game to win. Nobody won but the 2-3 players who wanted this type of ending

 

[Mullet]

This is just a poor point; roleplay is built around cooperation with other players, there's a reason we don't lock people in cells for days on end, or remove them from roleplaying with anyone else

I think event staff counted approximately eight executions during the period between rebels. I'm guessing these executions were issued for reasons of less consequence then spying on the bunker with the intent to kill off the rebellion. I don't buy into the argument that you don't like the idea of infiltrators because they may get killed as a result of their actions - and indeed, if someone is doing that they should be readily accepting that they'll be killed if found out.

the security measures we would have to put in place to catch these infiltrators are just unfun

I see this argument, but infiltrators are due their fun if they wish to do that ICly. Which they did. Actions could have been taken to prevent the infiltrators: surveillance systems, patrols, better organization, more area restriction on clearances. It's difficult to do that though when someone gets verbally lynched and compared to the Combine for suggesting ID lanyards though. Can't lie, kinda shooting yourself in the foot there...

 

[Omega]

I think event staff counted approximately eight executions during the period between rebels. I'm guessing these executions were issued for reasons of less consequence then spying on the bunker with the intent to kill off the rebellion.

Just making bold assumptions while being wrong. Everyone killed had actively tried to kill people in the bunker. You’re just coming to conclusions so you feel justified in fucking over the RolePlay going on.

 

[Rabid]

People wouldn't be so mad about Infiltrators if it wasn't inherently incredibly biased against rebels doing the reverse and having it matter. I say this as someone who mained The Combine for so long while also having a rebel that I grew to absolutely hate the concept of Combine spies for how easy it was.

Combine infiltrators - which by and large with a few exceptions go against how The Combine work anyway (and are distinct from loyalists in a city setting, before its brought up) - rely on the Resistance being open and accepting OOC. They know new characters won't be shot or turned away because it would cause an OOC shitstorm. You cannot keep track of every new person who runs in.

And like yeah, Rebels COULD have just shot every defecting loyalist in the head when they arrived but we can stop pretending that would have been a valid thing to do because everyone would have rightly blown up over it? Its a non-starter. It wouldn't have been possible.

Rebel infiltrators have to go through two layers of OOC tracking to do anything in return, with absolutely no way around it. They are likely monitored by faction leads. They're already "known" to the main people who can stop them before they've even started OOC, and in return those factions often don't have to jump through 200 IC hoops to catch them.

Its no wonder rebels want to throw their hands up over this sort of thing.

 

[Mullet]

It would have been great to have it matter before V2 ended.

TLM... is the ending for v2...?

 

[Mullet]

No offence but you're unironically one of the more Combine biased people on the server, dare I say the most Combine biased person. It's very hard to take anything you say seriously when a good portion, if not all, of your experiences stem from you playing OTA.

Mm. Was I introduced to Willard through OTA? Yes. Was it my first and principal WL for a period? Yes. Since then, I've gotten a CivPro WL and CMU WL having come back having left Willard for a time on a long hiatus. After which I then rejoined OTA via another application.

I don't think it's exactly a secret that I come from OTA origins. I'd like to think I've improved my outlook on the balance between rebels and combine, but hey, I'd imagine like everyone I'm not perfect. I can only try, and I'll continue to attempt to show that I do care.

You and a few others have done nothing but prevent this, and for what, the smug satisfaction your side won?

I, uh... don't get what you mean by this. Sorry.

 

[Kappatalist]

I think event staff counted approximately eight executions during the period between rebels. I'm guessing these executions were issued for reasons of less consequence then spying on the bunker with the intent to kill off the rebellion. I don't buy into the argument that you don't like the idea of infiltrators because they may get killed as a result of their actions - and indeed, if someone is doing that they should be readily accepting that they'll be killed if found out.

I didn't think it needed to be said, but no. I am perfectly fine with infiltrators dying as a result of their actions; but you're not reading into what I'm saying. I'm saying that if we're opening this can of worms then just about every loyalist who turned rebel ought to have been locked up or killed, as they present just the same qualities as any infiltrator did short of being caught in the act. (Exception to the Apothecary, we're just retarded in that case)

If an infiltrator can be killed or excluded from the event based on pure speculation, then so many other characters check those boxes as well who aren't. That is what I am saying. If they cannot, then it requires hard evidence, which is the case. And the odds of catching them in the act are incredibly slim - Even if we implemented the very fun idea of patrolling the bunker 24/7 and keeping everybody on a leash.

Therefore, sending characters into the event with the intention to infiltrate and sabotage the resistance, characters who presumably were created for this purpose, is just detrimental to the majority of the servers RP.

 

[Rabid]

I, uh... don't get what you mean by this. Sorry.

I think the implication from that post is that you are defending things that, were it to happen the other way around, would very quickly be written off or changed - namely the fact that the whole event around OCIN being taken down was rendered null and void within a week or two via a few CWU workers and loyalists in a way that couldn't be stopped by the Resistance.

That (and other recent events) then gives the feeling that several people who main The Combine are doing everything in their power to push back against this being a Rebel victory to close out the iteration by stacking the deck in unfair ways to make recent events unwinnable, even at the cost of ignoring the people running these events.

 

[Mullet]

I didn't think it needed to be said, but no. I am perfectly fine with infiltrators dying as a result of their actions; but you're not reading into what I'm saying. I'm saying that if we're opening this can of worms then just about every loyalist who turned rebel ought to have been locked up or killed, as they present just the same qualities as any infiltrator did short of being caught in the act. (Exception to the Apothecary, we're just retarded in that case)

If an infiltrator can be killed or excluded from the event based on pure speculation, then so many other characters check those boxes as well who aren't. That is what I am saying. If they cannot, then it requires hard evidence, which is the case. And the odds of catching them in the act are incredibly slim - Even if we implemented the very fun idea of patrolling the bunker 24/7 and keeping everybody on a leash.

Therefore, sending characters into the event with the intention to infiltrate and sabotage the resistance, characters who presumably were created for this purpose, is just detrimental to the majority of the servers RP.

I do think on reflection more could have been done before the advent of the bunker to figure out how infiltrators would be balanced re: being found beyond dumb luck. Though, again, that then becomes a concern regarding how it isn't then unfair against the guys who are IC and playing the infiltrators. It's all a bittttt difficult.

Sorry I didn't understand the original perspective, I think with regards to earlier comments again it'd be more palatable if rebels had similar chances with IC information they gained in months prior.

 

[Kappatalist]

Combine infiltrators - which by and large with a few exceptions go against how The Combine work anyway (and are distinct from loyalists in a city setting, before its brought up) - rely on the Resistance being open and accepting OOC. They know new characters won't be shot or turned away because it would cause an OOC shitstorm. You cannot keep track of every new person who runs in.

And, we've had this rodeo before. We've already dealt with OSI, and the consequence of that was rebel groups refused to invite anybody they didn't extensively know, frankly OOCly or ICLy. Routinely rebels were being accused of not doing anything or just being a massive circlejerk, but the alternative was opening up yourself to the Combine secret agents with no tells, ready to throw you and your entire group under the bus the first time you tried anything.

 

[RedHotGinger]

TLM... is the ending for v2...?

In a way, yes. In another way, the main server has been closed for over a week. The expo server, which acting as its primary continuation is now closed.

Point is, the fact OCIN being taken down takes a whole ass IRL month to start mattering (allegedly, we've been told all of this was supposed to matter to) is laughable. And even then, its just another 'we promise'

Up to this point, as I'm writing this, it hasn't mattered at all. That alone is problem enough.

 

[Mullet]

I think the implication from that post is that you are defending things that, were it to happen the other way around, would very quickly be written off or changed - namely the fact that the whole event around OCIN being taken down was rendered null and void within a week or two via a few CWU workers and loyalists in a way that couldn't be stopped by the Resistance.

That (and other recent events) then gives the feeling that several people who main The Combine are doing everything in their power to push back against this being a Rebel victory to close out the iteration by stacking the deck in unfair ways to make recent events unwinnable, even at the cost of ignoring the people running these events.

Ah, ok! I can't really do much about this perception, as it's less so about just me and more the thoughts of people. Everyone is entitled to their opinions, my own would be that this isn't accurate to the reality but yeh.

 

[RedHotGinger]

I see this argument, but infiltrators are due their fun if they wish to do that ICly.

@rae If only we'd known this...

 

[Mullet]

In a way, yes. In another way, the main server has been closed for over a week. The expo server, which acting as its primary continuation is now closed.

Point is, the fact OCIN being taken down takes a whole ass IRL month to start mattering (allegedly, we've been told all of this was supposed to matter to) is laughable. And even then, its just another 'we promise'

Up to this point, as I'm writing this, it hasn't mattered at all. That alone is problem enough.

OCIN as a target has always been a bit.. bad as a target. The functions for how it goes typically are too disruptive or not disruptive enough to combine RP. I think it'd be better for something like, attacking a railway/transit hub which would lessen the D20 chances for synths as parts of events for a period, something like that that has a notable and easily definable consequence for the combine.

On this note, the D20 approach for risk factors as introduced by Rad is something I think we need to work to implementing more. The basic idea being a risk factor for different things (xenian flora, infestations, OTA, synths, etc) will be decided based on a dice roll which combines with the natural state of the objective on an easy --> hard scale to affect the response the active body of players will encounter.

 

[rae]

Honestly with all that being said, you need to remember one thing about infiltrators in the bunker.

Rebels thought we were divided for good, the interactions with OTA came as a surprise, let alone the infiltrators. The fact that we weren't allowed entry into the city (don't think that its impossible, my character could've made the swap but I thought we were being divided and I didn't want to intrude on the remaining loyalist roleplay by doing muh infil)

If we weren't allowed into the loyalist server, we thought the loyalist server weren't allowed into ours. You can say that ICly it was 'hunkered down' but, we also kinda were hunkered down ourselves? Overwatch lost several dropships and the region clearly had hostile airspace, still could drop down and send in infiltrators though. Infact we weren't ever going to be facilitated to do such a thing as we were left mainly to our own devices in distorted events without a clear chain, if you ask 90% of the council what they did during the bunker time, it'd be two words:

Damage control

Literally nothing else happened in the bunker, no opportunities to do anything aside from damage control, flex your muscle and brace for the next punch in the gut that sends the entire bunker awry again. Oh well

@rae If only we'd known this...

Honestly Willard needs to pay me for my infiltration efforts, shit felt like a 9-5

 

[nath1234567]

... but like... that's his job? To try and get the Combine a win? He's not allowed to want the Combine to win, but rebels can want rebels to win...? I don't understand that line of argument.




Infiltration was all done ICly by actual player chars. The length for which these chars had existed is questionable, but by no means were they GM chars as you imply here...

Erama logged on and was in a non-descript place, receiving the radio transmissions from his spies ICly. He then forwarded this onto me, again ICly by meeting my EOW on the loyalist server. In this capacity, I functioned as an OTA WL-holder to provide 'Overwatch' information (which is something that was cleared through my faction management as I asked for 'carte blanche' permissions on my EOW and was approved for such). I then took this information back to the rebel server having received it through IC channels to then effect OTA actions using both OTA-WL'ed players and GMs, resulting in a grand total of.... zero PKs, zero NLR-refund/no-refunds, and one kidnap wherein I took actions to ensure the player char survived. Oh, and I tried to perform passive actions first on that player but they shot at us first cus they got jumpscared by a soldier staring at them in close proximity, so understandably the soldier returned fire, downed him and then tied him up and applied medical before extracting for information, et cetera on that.

None of the GMs were involved in any actions relating to the infiltrators -- the only interaction between OTA and the infiltrators came in the form of a drop-off for the hard drive, and this was performed using WL'ed only.




From what I've heard, you gave a green light for this assault to take place. Unless what I've heard from multiple channels is wrong, you hence said yes to the assault... and are now turning about to blame it on others, without taking responsibility.

Maybe I am wrong, but if you were involved in green-lighting that stuff then there does reside a level of joint-responsibility for the shitshow that came to pass...




Also curious as to how you found this out from the community, considering there wasn't a feedback thread...

1. No, his job isn't to come to the forums and try to shame everyone who feels slighted about obvious one sided storytelling with crazy claims about how some events ran by ET don't deserve to be honored (namely the one where rebels won, how odd that this is the event you all won't shut up about.) There are people who exist within the creative process and people who are supposed to play the game vs absolutely freaking out about how things at events go when they lose.

2. I've already explained to you at length why a feedback thread wasn't made and have spent hours upon hours speaking to those who claim that the OCIN event went poorly. All conversations I've had with people who claim it went poorly amount to complaints about how the Combine weren't depicted strongly enough despite all the aforementioned work I did to place balancing within the hands of OWF leadership and ensuring that both sides were represented fairly in terms of playercount. Once again, the only thing that went out of hand during that event was a combine helicopter that downed 20 ppl and killed 8, and that benefits combine side. Sorry, I won't be making a thread to open the door to you and others to shit on an entire event in public because you're sad that the cool multiversal alien empire sustained a loss. I was more than clear that I wanted conversations related to that to be limited to people that are actually involved in the creative process because I find the idea of allowing the entire playerbase to dogpile GMs on how things should have gone in a public thread to be extremely hostile to GMs and also extremely counterproductive to creating a community where people roleplay as characters vs coming to the forums to freak out when something they don't like happens.


I'll bring the rest of my response about this to you directly.