Implemented A Senate

[Merlinsclaw]

I have a thesis.
We prioritize blind dystopia over fun RP.
Political RP (as we have seen with the Futurist stuff) can serve as a catalyst for some cool stuff.
Also look at the SCs above.

The CCA is boring. It's an admin faction.
I propose an alternative that will hopefully help Loyalist RP.

A Senate.

THE IDEA
A Senate is created to govern and make laws for the City. It is compromised up of 15-30 players.
The City Administrator is at the Head of the Entire City.

Inside the Senate there are a few positions.
The Prime Minister, who leads the government.
Ministers who each run a department.
And Senators who make up a voting block.

ELECTIONS
The Prime Minister is elected by the public every few months.
He appoints the Ministers.

The Senators are permeant characters in the CCA.
You can apply OOCly, there is no SC requirement.

2 Senators are elected by the public each month.
They serve as Public Representatives.

THE PARTIES
Any group of 3 senators can start a political party.
Any party is allowed as long as it doesn't call for the downfall of the government.
Communist, Liberal, Futurist, Transhumanist, Humanist, Unionist, whatever.

Citizens can join too. Parties can make their own militias to protect their Senators.

VOTING
Any group of three senators can write legislation.
They propose it to the Senate to be voted on.
The senate votes on it. It becomes a law if it passes.
It'd likely be private forum based voting (and occasional in-game meetings)

Laws can't be about defense. Think housing, loyalism, food, safety, regulations, etc.
The City Admin can veto anything.

THE GOVERNMENT
When the Prime Minister gets elected, he chooses his Ministers.
He can dismiss them at any time.

There'd likely be a Minister of Health, Justice, Loyalty, Defense, Commerce, and Internal Affairs.
Maybe more. Maybe less.

They'd be made up of Senators.


COOL IDEAS AND STUFF
The fact that the P.M is elected by the population can make a split in the Senate.
The Senate may be 100% on the side of Candidate X. Candidate Y might be elected by popular support though.

Militias would be legally recognized. Go crazy. Go beat up your opposing political opponents.

Public Representatives (the elected Senators) could get some cool powers.
They could suspend (halt the voting period) on a bill if they get 20 signatures.
Another 40 on a petition that they can kill a bill.

Opposition Governments can form in the Senate.
The loser (or any loser) can declare themselves Shadow Prime Minister and work against the government.

Coalition Governments could also form.
Players teaming up together. Makes drama.

LOYALISM
Hopefully this would fix the Loyalist SC grind.
Go suck up to some Senator. He'll give you points.
Work for the government (snitch out your neighbor)
Join a militia.


HOW AND WHY?
Don't think of blind dystopia. Instead think of the R.P that can be had.
Player Initiative will always be cool.
One player will scheme over another.
The G.N.C will bone the Futurists for power.


To start?
Find a player, interim prime minister. I'd be glad to do it. Start the system up.
Contact me, or don't.

See you on Page 11 of this debate.




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[TheDeNuke]

Honestly, I'd only be willing to help setup something like this if the player cap was at 15 (as any more would be too many) and Directors are automatically given seats on this council. That would limit the amount of initial empty seats on this council.

I'd also prefer if we called it a "Committee" or "Council" rather then a Senate as "Senate" feels like too much of a old world relic whereas calling it something unrelated ex. "Committee" or "Council" would work far better (C17 actually has a "Security Council" in canon lore). The sector-wide CA meeting (Auspicius Preamble) was called the "S10 CA Council" as a example (and they will keep happening from time to time as I find that the S10 CA Council was a great way to provide changes to the sector lore).

 

[Merlinsclaw]

Honestly, I'd only be willing to help setup something like this if the player cap was at 15 (as any more would be too many) and Directors are automatically given seats on this council. That would limit the amount of initial empty seats on this council.

I'd also prefer if we called it a "Committee" or "Council" rather then a Senate as "Senate" feels like too much of a old world relic whereas calling it something unrelated ex. "Committee" or "Council" would work far better (C17 actually has a "security council" in lore). The sector-wide CA meeting (Auspicius Preamble) was called the "S10 CA Council" as a example (and they will keep happening from time to time as I find that the S10 CA Council was a great way to provide changes to the sector lore).

Cap it off at 15 for quality control, give directors a seat, call it a council.

I'm fine with it all tbh

 

[RealGamer]

Yeah why not?

 

[TheDeNuke]

Preferably, we should not even refer it to a "Senate" in any regards (as that is controversial) and just call it what it is: A Politburo that exists to create and pass legislation.

There should be three (currently there are two that already exist) of these "Politburo" Councils:

1. The "City" Security Council (15 or so members)
2. The "Sector" Administrative Council (however many cities exist in the Sector)
3. The "Global" Summit (Summit 24 and consists of all Sector Admins).

I feel that we should take some time and finally get around to setting up the City-Level Council.

 

[The Milkman]

The Tokyo Volunteer Corps was so fucking based

RIP David Ji

 

[Conundrum]

City 24 is slowly becoming Paris, despite Paris doing nothing to try and convert us. Maybe Casto's aggressive indoctrination attempts have had an adverse effect. Who is to say.

Anyhow @Lord Beckett

A bit of a surface level concern would have to be CCA bloat. The scoreboard would be filled with quite a few people who have the whitelist when they don't really have any duties inside of the City, besides waiting for the next political rally. Which could undersell the actual importance of the role. I'd just advise allowing all Tier 6's to be part of this council and to vote on district/city matters.

Just allow some people to do character auths to make a new character as an automatic Tier 6 to spice up the Collaborators scene. As it stands it is already difficult enough to reach that point as the cities leadership itself has to select you.

Tier 6's should probably be senators, rather than strictly CCA.

 

[Cloudbucket]

Casto!

Yes this is a wonderful idea! +support!

 

[TheDeNuke]

City 24 is slowly becoming Paris, despite Paris doing nothing to try and convert us. Maybe Casto's aggressive indoctrination attempts have had an adverse effect. Who is to say.

Anyhow @Lord Beckett

A bit of a surface level concern would have to be CCA bloat. The scoreboard would be filled with quite a few people who have the whitelist when they don't really have any duties inside of the City, besides waiting for the next political rally. Which could undersell the actual importance of the role. I'd just advise allowing all Tier 6's to be part of this council and to vote on district/city matters.

Yes, Security Council members should not be exclusively members of the CCA and consist of Directors, T6s and selected T5s.

Directors+T6+Overseers?+Specific T5 would be enough to fill up the Security Council without the need for dedicated characters which we should really avoid as council members should be inherently appointed at first rather then elected. Which is why your reference to the Republicans of City 13 makes no sense as they actually elect people over there whereas anyone on this council would be appointed (unless @Lord Beckett is willing to open up slots that are publicly elected but that's ICly up to Newcastle).

I do want to discuss the scope of the legislation that this council can implement at some point. I might make a fourm thread on it.

 

[Dej]

This has my full support. Politics always have the potential to create spicy drama/events. Especially if Player Driven. It allows for more error, and error means RP, RP means fun, fun means I don't sit in bed bored 24/7.

Senates means Elections (hopefully), elections means rallying, rallying means events, events = fun. Especially if its centered around Citizens who are very much lacking things to do most of the time. Politicians can go out and interact instead of remaining holed up in the Nexus.

I remember during a Loyalist Meeting early on into the server that involved all the Directors and City Administrators that proposed a creation of a sort of "Loyalist Council", while it was an apparent figurehead council the idea was shot down during IC voting (or OOC idk). Either way, fun shit.

 

[Kamilisha Haijulikani]

So long as we replicate the politics of the prequel trilogy to a T, I can support this.

 

[Maroon]

A very interesting idea. I support 8)

 

[Ronald]

I dislike the idea. Only because it pushes the core of RP in a different direction, I've seen it done in another server previously and depending on who was involved at the time, either all RP in the server revolved around it to the level where even if people didn't want to be involved they were forced to, and equally to the level it was so secluded it had no impact whatsoever. Like most ideas. I see positives, but for me, the negatives outweigh these.

 

[Robert]

A council will help boost what the Loyalists currently need but again the council overall needs to be well thought out for it not to become a position that quickly becomes boring or becomes a chore to operate. We can let in CCA, Directors and T5-T6 into it, but would need to think how this council operates, what it does, how often does it actually come together to not make it a job nor chore, nor lose its purpose too quickly, etc.

Like I have requested Leads of CCA to make a council around 1 month ago and so far nothing was made (Mainly because School, College and Uni has crushed their focus on HL2RP and the faction and thus no longer have time to work on anything). But the idea can't be too rushed either since of course well not only is it quite fragile in its own way, you also do have to be careful with how it is implemented.

I dislike the idea. Only because it pushes the core of RP in a different direction, I've seen it done in another server previously and depending on who was involved at the time, either all RP in the server revolved around it to the level where even if people didn't want to be involved they were forced to, and equally to the level it was so secluded it had no impact whatsoever. Like most ideas. I see positives, but for me, the negatives outweigh these.

This right here is valid in itself on top of what I have said so far.

We can implement one, but would have to be extremely careful on how it comes in, how it operates, and yadda yadda (repeating my above statement) in order to make sure this is not just one of those "The Council exists... but no one actually sees it nor contributes to it" type of things or one of those "Well this only lasted a couple of weeks/months before dying" since most councils I have seen do quite easily become stale if one is not too careful.

So I would say this would be a good suggestion to look into, but would also require a lot of talks on how we would like something like this to be implemented without threatening its existence day 1.

 

[Kamilisha Haijulikani]

A council will help boost what the Loyalists currently need but again the council overall needs to be well thought out for it not to become a position that quickly becomes boring or becomes a chore to operate. We can let in CCA, Directors and T5-T6 into it, but would need to think how this council operates, what it does, how often does it actually come together to not make it a job nor chore, nor lose its purpose too quickly, etc.

Like I have requested Leads of CCA to make a council around 1 month ago and so far nothing was made (Mainly because School, College and Uni has crushed their focus on HL2RP and the faction and thus no longer have time to work on anything). But the idea can't be too rushed either since of course well not only is it quite fragile in its own way, you also do have to be careful with how it is implemented.


This right here is valid in itself on top of what I have said so far.

We can implement one, but would have to be extremely careful on how it comes in, how it operates, and yadda yadda (repeating my above statement) in order to make sure this is not just one of those "The Council exists... but no one actually sees it nor contributes to it" type of things or one of those "Well this only lasted a couple of weeks/months before dying" since most councils I have seen do quite easily become stale if one is not too careful.

So I would say this would be a good suggestion to look into, but would also require a lot of talks on how we would like something like this to be implemented without threatening its existence day 1.

Decentralizing power away from two core despots and funnelling that power back into the player base and most specifically citizenry would be ideal. It offers the ability for representatives of the community to form a body that can enact legislative reforms on behalf of the citizenry and would the culmination of all the political roleplay prior, in which the assembly can periodically shift from one end of the spectrum to the other, as well as offer the opportunity to other citizens and senators to form their political ideology and expand on what is already present.

As it stands, loyalist roleplay is boring and built upon nepotism and favouritism with no effective in-character measure to counteract these issues, and the formation of a legislative diet which would act as an extension of the Civil Administration's executive branch could resolve many of the issues citizens take offence too if they are vocal enough. It also allows for a vocal minority to seize control and swing Union policy in an opposite direction if they're persistent and vocal enough.



I had high hopes for the promised Chairperson role which would've turned the Collaborator's Party into its faction, allowing for more activity and flexibility in the party's policy and doctrine. But unfortunately with the inactivity of the Core Civil Administration, I doubt we'd ever see such hopes come to fruition, which is why it is ever more essential to empower a politburo that could enact edicts and address issues on behalf of the already inactive Core Civil Administration.

 

[Gyrann]

It all boils down to how much power is given to this council. If it's just a facade and nothing they do matters then it will die. I guarantee it.

This new istitution should hold real power to counterbalance the CA himself and his powertrips.

 

[TheDeNuke]

It all boils down to how much power is given to this council. If it's just a facade and nothing they do matters then it will die. I guarantee it.

This new istitution should hold real power to counterbalance the CA himself and his powertrips.

It should have theoretically infinite power so long as its focused on City issues and does not touch the Overwatch Forces or anything they command.

As for how this is setup, I recommend doing something similar to what I did for the Sector Council in where there is a period where individuals can suggest legislation and the CA/OWF/CMs can freely accept or deny legislation prior to it going to a vote in the Council.

Basically:
1. CA calls a session.
2. People (individuals with loyalist characters) suggest legislation on the forums (as formal documents ex. Sector Council).
3. CCA/OWF/CMs select some legislation and deny others.
4. The session occurs.
5. If legislation is passed at the session then it is implemented.

The sessions are not mandatory and are freely called by the CA at their will but I advise that the CM's will generally push for at least one session to occur per month.

 

[Merlinsclaw]

Have the Council be able to actually vote and have power.

Voting (legislation) can be voted on the forums or during occasional in-game legislative sessions.

I’d rather have OOC applications compared to a Tier restriction. All that shows is your grind ability and restricts great people from the faction.

Prime Minister would be publicly elected but the first one would be interim and appointed.

Public Reps (with their powers) would be for anyone to run for

____

Admittedly the system has a few problems. Time between elections can be dull and there is always the “ivory tower” effect.

Use Militias to protect you. Keep Public Reps on their toes. Keep elections fresh, etc.

____

I’d be willing to set up, draft, and run the system as interim prime minister until the first election. But y’know
@Robert
@TheDeNuke

 

[Conundrum]

Which is why your reference to the Republicans of City 13 makes no sense as they actually elect people over there whereas anyone on this council would be appointed (unless @Lord Beckett is willing to open up slots that are publicly elected but that's ICly up to Newcastle).

Because we're slowly turning it into a democracy? One of the original suggestions was quite literally voting in some senators? Arguments in the topic about giving power to the people? Prime ministers?

All the same I'm not really against this. Just be aware of the potential CCA bloat...

 

[Merlinsclaw]

Because we're slowly turning it into a democracy? One of the original suggestions was quite literally voting in some senators? Arguments in the topic about giving power to the people? Prime ministers?

All the same I'm not really against this. Just be aware of the potential CCA bloat...

I’d rather not put good RPers on the multi-month grind to T6 so that they can roleplay. Just do applications.

Also le China is a democracy because they have a legislative body!!!