Implemented Remove Kitchen Supply Deterioration

[RogueSynapse]

Problem: Kitchen Supplies break far too easy. Only being able to cook 16 meals with a pot before it shatters isn't very realistic and it makes diving into the cooking endeavor a waste of funds. It was much better during the beta when you could have your designated tools and kitchen supplies that made a set that felt special to you. If I had to guess I would presume it was added in an attempt to increase item sales but frankly for me and many of my friends it has done the opposite.

Solution: If they absolutely must have deterioration, make it something far more realistic. These things are made of black iron, not cardboard. Something akin to 70-90 uses if better off. (Again would totally prefer item condition be left to the RPer though.)

 

[araskes]

pots and pans last YEARS ooc, idk why this is a thing.

 

[Steel]

Literally have been using my pots and pans irl for like 8 years, lol.

 

[Rebel RP Philosopher]

Planned obsolescence
If we base it on being as effective as a real one then might aswell remove deterioration as a whole.

Pro
One time visit to get a pan

Con
Store that sells you cannot be economically viable on selling pans due to lack of returning consumer for selected item.

Should perhaps add a repair item instead.

 

[RogueSynapse]

Planned obsolescence
If we base it on being as effective as a real one then might aswell remove deterioration as a whole.

Pro
One time visit to get a pan

Con
Store that sells you cannot be economically viable on selling pans due to lack of returning consumer for selected item.

Should perhaps add a repair item instead.

I mean there's also a one time visit per clothing item. After I buy a shirt I'm not going to buy the same shirt on the same character. I will however need to for other supplies like ingredients and whatnot, as you should realistically. Even if you can only sell one pan or whatever per citizen, that's still good business and promotes the selling of ingredients and other food items. Stuff that isn't selling right now because of this tool issue.

 

[Conundrum]

I mean there's also a one time visit per clothing item. After I buy a shirt I'm not going to buy the same shirt on the same character.

Well, people buy clothing for other reasons. Such as breaking them down into stitched cloth, which consumes the clothing articles and creates a continued demand for more of them. If we remove deterioration on tools then there ceases to be a demand for them from anyone but fresh spawns without resources, which is presuming they do not have direct access to fabrication sites with all they need inside the containers. (An entire Macro Rebel group could subsist off 1 of each set of tools for all of their fabrication needs)

The tools and storage permit would lose a lot of its reason for existing in such a case, Since once tools are in circulation they are then there forever.

Doing this would have an adverse effect on the entire crafting ecosystem and destabilise it in ways that are entirely beyond me. It needs a bit more consideration than simply being convenient and realistic.

 

[Atle]

Well, people buy clothing for other reasons. Such as breaking them down into stitched cloth, which consumes the clothing articles and creates a continued demand for more of them. If we remove deterioration on tools then there ceases to be a demand for them from anyone but fresh spawns without resources, which is presuming they do not have direct access to fabrication sites with all they need inside the containers. (An entire Macro Rebel group could subsist off 1 of each set of tools for all of their fabrication needs)

The tools and storage permit would lose a lot of its reason for existing in such a case, Since once tools are in circulation they are then there forever.

Doing this would have an adverse effect on the entire crafting ecosystem and destabilise it in ways that are entirely beyond me. It needs a bit more consideration than simply being convenient and realistic.

This, pretty much. We didn't always have deterioration on tools, they used to last forever. As Starless said, the results were the tools permit and such became completely useless as you'd only ever need to buy 1 tool and you're good to go forever.

 

[albertossic]

Maybe just add a way to maintain tools that is significantly cheaper than replacing them?
For example, increase the durability of a toolkit and allow kitchenware to be repaired with one use of the toolkit
If a toolkit has 30 uses and costs a toolstore (assuming legality) 70 credits, then you'd only need to charge like 8 credits per repair and it'd be fairly profitable to buy a toolkit for the purpose of maintenance, and for the people with the knife, every 15 recipes would cost then a 8 credit repair, the equivalent of a roughly 2 credit surcharge on every meal, which is less than the cost of most single crafting ingredients

Could go hand in hand with more expensive, but more durable tools if that's what people want I guess

 

[Xor]

Maybe just add a way to maintain tools that is significantly cheaper than replacing them?
For example, increase the durability of a toolkit and allow kitchenware to be repaired with one use of the toolkit
If a toolkit has 30 uses and costs a toolstore (assuming legality) 70 credits, then you'd only need to charge like 8 credits per repair and it'd be fairly profitable to buy a toolkit for the purpose of maintenance, and for the people with the knife, every 15 recipes would cost then a 8 credit repair, the equivalent of a roughly 2 credit surcharge on every meal, which is less than the cost of most single crafting ingredients

Could go hand in hand with more expensive, but more durable tools if that's what people want I guess

Stores are not allowed to sell wrenches/toolkits, they're allowed to charge a repair service however already.

 

[albertossic]

Stores are not allowed to sell wrenches/toolkits, they're allowed to charge a repair service however already.

I know. My character works at a toolstore.
You're allowed to charge a repair service, but there is no repair mechanic. When I offer repairs, it is RP that winds up with the customer getting a full durability tool somehow, it's not actually resetting the durability counter on a tool.

That's literally the whole point of my post

 

[Xor]

I know. My character works at a toolstore.
You're allowed to charge a repair service, but there is no repair mechanic. When I offer repairs, it is RP that winds up with the customer getting a full durability tool somehow, it's not actually resetting the durability counter on a tool.

That's literally the whole point of my post

For some reason I misread 'costs a toolstore' as 'a toolstore charges' and I have no idea why, thought it was selling them for some reason.

 

[RogueSynapse]

This, pretty much. We didn't always have deterioration on tools, they used to last forever. As Starless said, the results were the tools permit and such became completely useless as you'd only ever need to buy 1 tool and you're good to go forever.

Even if there is only one pan per person, who cares?

There is an abundance of tools, ingredients, and other related items that can be bought. Having this agenda that every items needs to be purchasable several times makes no sense and has made for some rather silly rules and conditions to meet this quota.

The fear stated is that people will only buy the tool once and the store becomes obsolete, well people aren't buying them once to begin with now because it's common knowledge among the server that they are nowhere near worth the investment because they break like tissue paper.

I and six other friends of mine were going to work towards opening a soup kitchen and were saving up to buy the tools. Once me and one other member bought some kitchen supplies, I a pot and him a pan, we realized how awful of an endeavor this was going to be. We would be massively in debt due to not only having to buy a consistent supply of ingredients but also a stove, and tons of fragile kitchen supplies.

It's not a coincidence that 99.9% of food stores only sell products you can eat on the spot that don't require cooking with multiple kitchen tools.

EDIT: It's like I said before, if they NEED to break, sure, fine, not the most desirable route but at least made it more realistic. Anything less than 60ish uses per tool isn't realistic nor it it worth it at these prices.

 

[swagile]

Maybe just add a way to maintain tools that is significantly cheaper than replacing them?
For example, increase the durability of a toolkit and allow kitchenware to be repaired with one use of the toolkit
If a toolkit has 30 uses and costs a toolstore (assuming legality) 70 credits, then you'd only need to charge like 8 credits per repair and it'd be fairly profitable to buy a toolkit for the purpose of maintenance, and for the people with the knife, every 15 recipes would cost then a 8 credit repair, the equivalent of a roughly 2 credit surcharge on every meal, which is less than the cost of most single crafting ingredients

Could go hand in hand with more expensive, but more durable tools if that's what people want I guess

Gives toolkit an actual reason to exist besides rebelRP and still doesn't completely negate toolstores.

Plus tools are being bundled with other permits soon so you don't just sell kitchen gear soon.

So this is a pretty good middle ground.

 

[albertossic]

Even if there is only one pan per person, who cares?

There is an abundance of tools, ingredients, and other related items that can be bought. Having this agenda that every items needs to be purchasable several times makes no sense and has made for some rather silly rules and conditions to meet this quota.

The fear stated is that people will only buy the tool once and the store becomes obsolete, well people aren't buying them once to begin with now because it's common knowledge among the server that they are nowhere near worth the investment because they break like tissue paper.

I and six other friends of mine were going to work towards opening a soup kitchen and were saving up to buy the tools. Once me and one other member bought some kitchen supplies, I a pot and him a pan, we realized how awful of an endeavor this was going to be. We would be massively in debt due to not only having to buy a consistent supply of ingredients but also a stove, and tons of fragile kitchen supplies.

It's not a coincidence that 99.9% of food stores only sell products you can eat on the spot that don't require cooking with multiple kitchen tools.

Again, as somebody whose character works in a toolshop, people buy tools all the time - pans and knives are probably among the top sellers

This idea that everybody agrees that tools aren't "worth it" that's the basis of your complaint seems to be shared by nobody else, so..

 

[RogueSynapse]

Gives toolkit an actual reason to exist besides rebelRP and still doesn't completely negate toolstores.

Plus tools are being bundled with other permits soon so you don't just sell kitchen gear soon.

So this is a pretty good middle ground.

I'm not against the repair mechanic myself, but even still 16 uses per tool is waaaay too low.

 

[Robert]

I can do 2 things:

- Increase the durability of tools slightly. Not going to give a massive buff since the tool stores to get some top sales from some of those tools which break. If I set it too high, rent may catch up to them before long and bring them and their entire store to ruin

- Grant the ability for those running a tool store to repair these tools. I might do this via the general toolkit or I might find a way to create a new machine for tool stores to own which can have an insert slot for a tool, spend 60-120 seconds and then bring out a fully restored tool. Something like that. Though the latter may be the better option, though I swear a repair option for tools existed already?

If I do the machine idea, I might make it cost some basic and cheap materials which any store can easily afford thus giving them a reason to charge for repairs up to a certain amount.

 

[RogueSynapse]

I can do 2 things:

- Increase the durability of tools slightly. Not going to give a massive buff since the tool stores to get some top sales from some of those tools which break. If I set it too high, rent may catch up to them before long and bring them and their entire store to ruin

- Grant the ability for those running a tool store to repair these tools. I might do this via the general toolkit or I might find a way to create a new machine for tool stores to own which can have an insert slot for a tool, spend 60-120 seconds and then bring out a fully restored tool. Something like that. Though the latter may be the better option, though I swear a repair option for tools existed already?

If I do the machine idea, I might make it cost some basic and cheap materials which any store can easily afford thus giving them a reason to charge for repairs up to a certain amount.

Honestly doing both of those would make myself and many of those involved with the cooking scene a happy camper.

 

[Merlinsclaw]

I can do 2 things:

- Increase the durability of tools slightly. Not going to give a massive buff since the tool stores to get some top sales from some of those tools which break. If I set it too high, rent may catch up to them before long and bring them and their entire store to ruin

- Grant the ability for those running a tool store to repair these tools. I might do this via the general toolkit or I might find a way to create a new machine for tool stores to own which can have an insert slot for a tool, spend 60-120 seconds and then bring out a fully restored tool. Something like that. Though the latter may be the better option, though I swear a repair option for tools existed already?

If I do the machine idea, I might make it cost some basic and cheap materials which any store can easily afford thus giving them a reason to charge for repairs up to a certain amount.

I think the best option would be to take from Rust.

You start out with a tool that has 30/30 durability.
You repair it and you get 25/25 durability.
You repair it again at it goes to 20/20 durability.
So on and so forth until it finally breaks.

You have to eventually buy another tool but there is a purpose to repairing it.

 

[albertossic]

I can do 2 things:

- Increase the durability of tools slightly. Not going to give a massive buff since the tool stores to get some top sales from some of those tools which break. If I set it too high, rent may catch up to them before long and bring them and their entire store to ruin

- Grant the ability for those running a tool store to repair these tools. I might do this via the general toolkit or I might find a way to create a new machine for tool stores to own which can have an insert slot for a tool, spend 60-120 seconds and then bring out a fully restored tool. Something like that. Though the latter may be the better option, though I swear a repair option for tools existed already?

If I do the machine idea, I might make it cost some basic and cheap materials which any store can easily afford thus giving them a reason to charge for repairs up to a certain amount.

If there is, I haven't found it. My character offering repairs is kind of like a little ponzi scheme based on the fact that there is no real way to repair the tools

While a new machine (To have more use for all the space in a store interior besides deco) would be cool, I think tieing this mechanic to already existing stuff like toolkits would probably make it a bit more interesting for stores (since offering repairs depends on the periodic costly replacement of the toolkit) and smugglers/criminals (since the more legitimate reasons there are for our store to frequently order in toolkits, the easier it is for one to conveniently go missing)

 

[AdamCF]

I think the best option would be to take from Rust.

You start out with a tool that has 30/30 durability.
You repair it and you get 25/25 durability.
You repair it again at it goes to 20/20 durability.
So on and so forth until it finally breaks.

You have to eventually buy another tool but there is a purpose to repairing it.

This is probably the best compromise