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Denied Bill Greenwood

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MCG

MCG

Active member
Joined
May 24, 2023
Messages
197
Steam Name: MCGSCEFFAAWHETJH55555
Steam ID : STEAM_0:0:33130062
Discord Name: (Same as Steam name)
Character Name: Bill Greenwood
Faction/Group (If applicable): Citizen/Salvagers

Reason for Appeal:

The PK was apparently done because Halostrophe's character believed my character snitched on him, when everyone (including him) was there at the gate, watching Bill rant loudly to everyone, citizen and officer alike, about (Halostrophe) standing at the gate and attracting the zombies, which eventually did cause the barricade to fall and zombies to swarm the park for the sixth time.

Today, I was brought to his base under RP false pretenses, at which point I walked up near them and they immediately pasted /mes saying they aimed right at me and shot me in the head. I called powergaming so the GM suggested a re-write, at which point we roleplayed and I complied. Then one of the two PK-related characters present suggested OOCly if I was up for a graphic RP, which I considered both stereotypically bad and in poor taste. Which then proceeded to a beheading anyway.

It didn't make much for riveting roleplay, especially since the start of all this was something I felt had little basis to go that far. If those cops went for (Halostrophe)'s character immediately once my character yelled about it, then fine. I only told the officers what I had seen as Bill based on what had happened during/immediately before. Why was there a PK on something that was not only discussed publicly at length, but something that, if it was dangerous information, would have been acted on much earlier?

Counter-Evidence/Arguments:

I got nothing. I was not even expecting this to be a problem and I didn't save anything about this, since I assumed it was just a regular abrasive conversation, not the direct inspiration for a PK auth.

Proof of counter-evidence:

N/A

Additional Information (Optional): N/A
 
Johnny Evil said:
Hi, I was one of the characters that were watching the event unfold.
You never actually disputed the snitch claims other than begging for your life, and then consented to being beheaded. This pk appeal should be null
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You can pull up the logs. I specifically said in character several times that I did not snitch. I didn't consent to being beheaded. He just went ahead and did it because that's what his character wanted to do.
 
Okay, so here is my perspective of the events that transpired.

One of my own members informed me that Precinct were looking into us. The Precinct officers informed my member that they were looking for my character and even mentioned the nickname the snitch had given them. They did a sloppy job and effectively let slip that the snitch was a male. My character knows only two people are aware of the nickname in question, one being a female and the other being a male (you).

So, what we ICly had to work with was the fact that it seems to us that you snitched out and were talking to Precinct about my affairs. Precinct were sloppy in whatever the hell they were doing that we had an idea of things with importantly Precinct being on our case. We saw you as the link that caused all of this and believed that you had to go.

We planned your murder, we set the stage, Lumbago's character lured you in on false pretenses (which is valid, I have been PK'd with that strategy) to get you where we wanted. The initial thing was very sloppy (because we did not expect you to come up to the first floor) but of course it was rectified and we of course RPed it all out with you complying. Then of course your murder came after because as the post above did mention. You did not really dispute the claims, and you begged for your life if anything.
 
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Halostrophe said:
Okay, so here is my perspective of the events that transpired.

One of my own members informed me that Precinct were looking into us. The Precinct officers informed my member that they were looking for my character and even mentioned the nickname the snitch had given them. They did a sloppy job and effectively let slip that the snitch was a male. My character knows only two people are aware of the nickname in question, one being a female and the other being a male (you).

So, what we ICly had to work with was the fact that it seems to us that you snitched out and were talking to Precinct about my affairs. Precinct were sloppy in whatever the hell they were doing that we had an idea of things with importantly Precinct being on our case. We saw you as the link that caused all of this and believed that you had to go. Especially since they were suspecting us of the recent bomb attack.

We planned your murder, we set the stage, Lumbago's character lured you in on false pretenses (which is valid, I have been PK'd with that strategy) to get you where we wanted. The initial thing was very sloppy (because we did not expect you to come up to the first floor) but of course it was rectified and we of course RPed it all out with you complying. Then of course your murder came after because as the post above did mention. You did not really dispute the claims, and you begged for your life if anything.
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I can corroborate the information here. If staff wants a statement from me, please shoot me a DM to avoid further potential for metagame.
 
Halostrophe said:
Okay, so here is my perspective of the events that transpired.

One of my own members informed me that Precinct were looking into us. The Precinct officers informed my member that they were looking for my character and even mentioned the nickname the snitch had given them. They did a sloppy job and effectively let slip that the snitch was a male. My character knows only two people are aware of the nickname in question, one being a female and the other being a male (you).

So, what we ICly had to work with was the fact that it seems to us that you snitched out and were talking to Precinct about my affairs. Precinct were sloppy in whatever the hell they were doing that we had an idea of things with importantly Precinct being on our case. We saw you as the link that caused all of this and believed that you had to go. Especially since they were suspecting us of the recent bomb attack.

We planned your murder, we set the stage, Lumbago's character lured you in on false pretenses (which is valid, I have been PK'd with that strategy) to get you where we wanted. The initial thing was very sloppy (because we did not expect you to come up to the first floor) but of course it was rectified and we of course RPed it all out with you complying. Then of course your murder came after because as the post above did mention. You did not really dispute the claims, and you begged for your life if anything.
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But that is not where it began. This all started based on what was said in the park, which you eventually alluded to IC. Are you saying that you had no intention to PK my character until someone decided to follow up on it, even though the origin of this whole problem does not change either way?

What difference is there? Also, how did you not expect my character to come to the first floor? If this was plotted with Lumbago's character, surely you would have synchronised the excuse used to lure my character in. There's only one way up to where you two were. That does not really explain why you both seemed to type up your actions and pressed Enter as SOON as you saw me.

If you think anything I said there was my character begging for his life, I have nothing for you.
 
Johnny Evil said:
Basically this, you never argued with being killed despite an looc request, I don't see why this should be accepted.
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How exactly is this an argument? Are you saying that if I said I didn't want to get killed in LOOC, that just magically revokes the PK and neither of you would have proceeded with it?

I don't think any character in that situation would WANT to die.
 
Johnny Evil said:
At any point you could've called staffed but you let the pk happen, never asked staff if this was legit in game, fell for a trap, never argued in looc of why it was happening other than pleading, went to the forums.
The pk is valid under the rules as Halo stated. Sorry bro.
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You do realize that the policy of a PK playing out is that you play it out without interrupting through @, right? The complaints come *later*, hence this appeal being written after the fact, not during it.

Your passive-aggressive wording is not doing you any favors, regardless of how this appeal goes.
 
MCG said:
But that is not where it began. This all started based on what was said in the park, which you eventually alluded to IC. Are you saying that you had no intention to PK my character until someone decided to follow up on it, even though the origin of this whole problem does not change either way?

What difference is there? Also, how did you not expect my character to come to the first floor? If this was plotted with Lumbago's character, surely you would have synchronised the excuse used to lure my character in. There's only one way up to where you two were. That does not really explain why you both seemed to type up your actions and pressed Enter as SOON as you saw me.

If you think anything I said there was my character begging for his life, I have nothing for you.
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The plotting of your murder was based on the fact that Precinct did otherwise a sloppy job on investigating us and was exacerbated by the fact that you were easily identified (based on who knew my fake identity) as the reporter who drew attention to us.

The cops are the blame of your death. As in real life where cops do a poor job of protecting witnesses, snitches or just generally anyone that provides information. These witnesses tend to become victims out of retribution or fear that they provide further information. They disappear, end up found dead and etc.​

As for the roleplay that transpired? It was all moderated by a gamemaster, so there is null value in bringing it up.
 
Stop the back-and-forth if it isn't conducive to this appeal.

There is no reason to post memes/images, either, as that's just trash-talking and poor taste.
 
MCG said:
But that is not where it began. This all started based on what was said in the park, which you eventually alluded to IC. Are you saying that you had no intention to PK my character until someone decided to follow up on it, even though the origin of this whole problem does not change either way?

What difference is there? Also, how did you not expect my character to come to the first floor? If this was plotted with Lumbago's character, surely you would have synchronised the excuse used to lure my character in. There's only one way up to where you two were. That does not really explain why you both seemed to type up your actions and pressed Enter as SOON as you saw me.

If you think anything I said there was my character begging for his life, I have nothing for you.
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we've synchronized the excuse but like the setup was in another building and they radio'd me real quick that we were switching place, but didn't specify which floor.
 
Johnny Evil said:
Regardless, the pk is still valid as Halo stated on luring you in on false pretenses, having the same nickname the Precinct officers said.
You fell for a trap, so sad so bad, the pk is pretty valid
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Yet you're also missing the point. The point of the argument is not how the PK played out, even if it was done poorly, but the *reason*. Bill knew nothing about a bomb or whatever it is Halostrophe was outlining, and what Halostrophe said during the roleplay is different from what is being explained. The only thing Bill did is yell at him for being a weirdo in the park. The connection is objectively tenuous, and to escalate it because he/you/whoever *believes* Bill talked about things he did not know and that he should die for it is quite the reach.
 
Just for clarification, Johnny Evil isn't part of this PK or this appeal.

I have no clue what he was saying.
 
Hello all! I'll be locking this thread for now, pending a decision on this over the next day or so.

Sit tight folks and thanks for submitting your responses.
 
Hey,

Thank you for your appeal. Staff have reviewed it in detail, including the logs from both sides and the accounts of the players involved.

Decision: the PK stands.

The PK policy
A death counts as a PK when two questions are both answered with “yes”:
  1. Was the character’s death a direct or indirect result of the character’s own actions?
  2. Were all server rules followed in the events that led to this character’s death?

Question 1: the character’s own actions
In your appeal, you describe the PK as being based on Bill’s rant at the gate. The logs show that Bill’s involvement went well beyond that:

  • Shortly after the gate incident, Bill confronted “Zane” directly and made clear he suspected him.
  • Bill warned others about “Zane” over the radio and named him as the main suspect for the gate and the pentagrams.
  • Bill told a Precinct Lieutenant he believed Zane was behind the pentagrams, and told another character that he had “told them about Zane.”
  • Bill reported Zane to Precinct investigators, gave them a description, and later told them where he lived.

When the investigators came to his group’s base asking about “Zane,” they mentioned that the person who reported him was male. He had only given that alias directly to a small number of people, and Bill was the only one involved in the matter. From that, his group concluded Bill was the source, and the logs show that conclusion was correct.

You also asked why they didn’t act earlier if this was dangerous information. The logs show no sign that Bill was targeted until Precinct showed up at their base. Up to that point, the gate argument was a public dispute. Once it led to an investigation, it became a direct threat to them. Acting on that is a valid IC response.

Question 2: server rules
  • Luring Bill under false pretenses is legitimate IC deception.
  • A GM was present and oversaw the scene throughout.
  • In LOOC, you said you didn’t want to be part of a drawn-out torture scene. You were told the execution would not be that, and it wasn’t: it was carried out in a single action.
  • You were given the opportunity for a final /me before the scene ended.

Both questions are answered with “yes,” so Bill’s death remains a PK.


We understand this isn’t the outcome you were hoping for, and we’re sorry to see Bill go. He made a lot of noise about Zane, and in the end that caught up with him.


This thread will now be locked. If you have any questions about this decision, feel free to reach out through the known ways.
 
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After feedback from the appellant, a few points in the decision above have been clarified:
  • Bill had been voicing his suspicions about Zane before, during and after the gate incident, not only afterwards.
  • The radio messages and the “told them about Zane” remark were made privately to two characters, not to a wider audience. They’re mentioned because they show Bill was naming Zane as a suspect, not because they were public.
  • The conduct during the scene was reviewed as well and has been dealt with separately.

None of this changes the outcome.
 
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