Gear Wipe: The Sequel

[MisterMysteryMan]

Hello.

With the recent closure of the server. I think now is about the right time to bring up the topic of a "gear wipe" once more.

Currently, I believe that a gear wipe is the next step forward. Why? For the simple reason that rebels are far too well-equipped. Let's pause for a moment and take a look back at City 24 v4. At the start of the map's life cycle, there were DAILY insurrections, punishing slummers for the dastardly crime of being in the same area as insurgents. The majority of the time, there was no rhyme or reason to their shotcopping sides from scripts, a Breen statue was blown up because... Why not? Eventually, these uprisings were quelled due to Combine buffs, OTA deployments, and overwhelming strengths in numbers. But this once again was at the detriment of not only the slummer, but the average citizen as well. Increased Combine involvement in the slums greatly decreases roleplay freedom in what's supposed to be an area that's supposed to be out of the Combine's watchful eye. In a map that's almost 1:1 in some areas, as v4, I fear that v3 will share a very similar fate to its successor.

Not to mention, Rebels in general are vastly superior to CivPro or CCR at the moment. Back in v4, there was a specific group (Not gonna name any names, but I think we all know who I'm talking about here) that would shootcop almost daily and completely wipe out squads of civil protection that stood in their way. This, in turn, causes the "Anti-Fun hammer" to be smacked down on the Rebel scene, also known as OTA, to come in and whack any unfortunate rebels over to the PK Appeal section of the forums. I believe rebels in general progress far too rapidly, as you can walk out of the metro tunnels with mountains of scrap so long as you wield a crowbar, which won't take long to achieve in the first place. It doesn't help that there's simply nothing to make with the crafting system either; Once you've made a certain amount of items, such as a gas mask and filter, T1 Armour plating, a melee, a radio, and on occasion a scrap - That's IT, you've made everything you possible could've made. Rebel players - such as myself - refer to this as the "Great Filter" or "the wall", turning what used to be precious materials into measly chip tokens (which are what electronic scrap basically is)

The gear rebels often accumulate aren't even put to good use, sitting in their storage container, collecting dust until the next Expo is available. For the health of the server, I believe that a gear wipe is imperative for the health and longevity of the server, placing everyone on the same playing field to avoid the cycle of escalating responses from each side.

Let me know what you think.

 

[SlugGirl]

But, what about my 75 plushies?

 

[NanCi_]

Nah. Simply start recruiting CPs and OTA for their PvP skills so unless we wanna start doing rust monthly wipes. You'll just kill the server.

"Oh but the rebels are progressing too rapidly" = Anyone remember what happened a few months ago with terminal 7? I think everyone here enjoyed the poor map with 20-30 players averaging. It took 2 months to get a scrap SMG which if any decent person understands is terrible for willard PvP.

This individual here had proven that hes a kind of slaved moron whoring himself to the trash bag rather than doing something more productive. This guy has so many chips that he can buy anything yet he wont touch the loyalists, the civilian roleplay or anything to be exact simply sitting in his base with the chips he has whored over collecting dust.

The people who kept killing everyday got punished by having their entire group PK'd now if CPs would be fair they would also downgrade themselves back to pistols but they didnt. We should also ask the CPs this. If you killed 7-9 people who were the main reason you upgraded. Why arent you downgrading now? Why are you still walking around with riot gear?

"for the servers health" .... go fucking roleplay someone that isnt jerking off with another in a rebel base. Thank you for my aggressive take on this mans quote.

There is no reason to do item wipes anymore because as of right now OTA will respond in full force when a schmuck pulls out 5 vorts and 3 AR2 rifles from their ass. I will also speak for the loyalists. If the loyalists maybe were to be corrupt and actually coordinate more with rebels or in that case rather being a "I hate all rebels and i wont work with them" characters, you could maybe do some drug dealing... weapon smuggling... and basic corruption without the use of begging to players in OOC. We have plenty of simon mcshain replicas who are so fucking stale its ruining the server.

Blame the server that your chips aren't valuable and is ruining the entire server scene. Blame the players who don't want to roleplay because of a scary punishment. Blame everyone lmao

 

[MisterMysteryMan]

Nah. Simply start recruiting CPs and OTA for their PvP skills so unless we wanna start doing rust monthly wipes. You'll just kill the server.

"Oh but the rebels are progressing too rapidly" = Anyone remember what happened a few months ago with terminal 7? I think everyone here enjoyed the poor map with 20-30 players averaging. It took 2 months to get a scrap SMG which if any decent person understands is terrible for willard PvP.

This individual here had proven that hes a kind of slaved moron whoring himself to the trash bag rather than doing something more productive. This guy has so many chips that he can buy anything yet he wont touch the loyalists, the civilian roleplay or anything to be exact simply sitting in his base with the chips he has whored over collecting dust.

The people who kept killing everyday got punished by having their entire group PK'd now if CPs would be fair they would also downgrade themselves back to pistols but they didnt. We should also ask the CPs this. If you killed 7-9 people who were the main reason you upgraded. Why arent you downgrading now? Why are you still walking around with riot gear?

"for the servers health" .... go fucking roleplay someone that isnt jerking off with another in a rebel base. Thank you for my aggressive take on this mans quote.

There is no reason to do item wipes anymore because as of right now OTA will respond in full force when a schmuck pulls out 5 vorts and 3 AR2 rifles from their ass. I will also speak for the loyalists. If the loyalists maybe were to be corrupt and actually coordinate more with rebels or in that case rather being a "I hate all rebels and i wont work with them" characters, you could maybe do some drug dealing... weapon smuggling... and basic corruption without the use of begging to players in OOC. We have plenty of simon mcshain replicas who are so fucking stale its ruining the server.

Blame the server that your chips aren't valuable. Blame the players who don't want to roleplay because of a scary punishment. Blame everyone lmao

Alrighty... Let's see here.

"Simply start recruiting CPs and OTAs for their PvP skills."
... This is a roleplay server, the driving factor for whitelists into combine factors should be... Roleplay and not how many hours you got on CS2.
Not to mention, "PVP skills" is not the only thing you have to take into account when it comes to S2K, some people have better hardwire than others and run the server at a much smoother framerate. Compare someone who runs the game at 30fps compared to someone who runs it at 120fps, and you'll notice a stark difference.

"So, unless we wanna start doing rust monthly wipes. You'll just kill the server."
I'm going to assume you mean this as an example/hyperbole and not something I'm actually advocating for, as monthly wipes would absolutely kill the server. The last item we had was close to a year ago, before Terminal seven.

"Oh, but the rebels are progressing too rapidly." = Anyone remember what happened a few months ago with Terminal 7? I think everyone here enjoyed the poor map with 20-30 players on average. It took 2 months to get a scrap SMG, which, if any decent person understands, is terrible for willard PvP."

Terminal Seven is the complete inverse of the problem we have right now, taking two months instead of two days. But it's a false dichotomy to say we either progress too fast or progress too little. The main point I was trying to drive in is that we progress too fast, and hit the "Great filter" too early, turning valuable materials into worthless junk you offload to the smuggler the moment he respawns. V4 is miles better in terms of scavenging compared to Terminal Seven, no arguments there, but if we're going to act like there are zero problems with the scavenging and crafting system (which is 75% of the problem right now), then you, sir, are blind.


"his individual here had proven that hes a kind of slaved moron whoring himself to the trash bag rather than doing something more productive. This guy has so many chips that he can buy anything yet he wont touch the loyalists, the civilian roleplay or anything to be exact simply sitting in his base with the chips he has whored over collecting dust."
Ouch
J-just gonna move past these ad-hominens here...
But if you must know... I guess I could say my chip bag is quite hefty...
(Humble brag)

The people who kept killing everyday got punished by having their entire group PK'd now if CPs would be fair they would also downgrade themselves back to pistols but they didnt. We should also ask the CPs this. If you killed 7-9 people who were the main reason you upgraded. Why arent you downgrading now? Why are you still walking around with riot gear?

Completely agree, if you were given temporary power to deal with a temporary solution, you should hand that power back. (This statement could be applied elsewhere)

"for the servers health" .... go fucking roleplay someone that isnt jerking off with another in a rebel base. Thank you for my aggressive take on this mans quote.

My Brother in Christ I want to roleplay, but I CAN'T if Rebels blew up the ration terminal for the fifth time this week, I can count how many times I've had my roleplay with my fellow slummers on both hands. I've been beaten. shot, burned, and kicked out of balconies thanks to French Elephants Fringe elements that have me punished on their behalf from extremely disgruntled officers that had eight of their friends massacred. This forces me into that rebel circle-jerk you said earlier, why should I be punished for something I didn't do for the sixth time in a row?

There is no reason to do item wipes anymore because as of right now OTA will respond in full force when a schmuck pulls out 5 vorts and 3 AR2 rifles from their ass.

I don't really have much to say when it comes to OTA deployment, as I haven't dealt with them first-hand, I'm sure someone else can take it from here.

I will also speak for the loyalists. If the loyalists maybe were to be corrupt and actually coordinate more with rebels or in that case rather being a "I hate all rebels and i wont work with them" characters, you could maybe do some drug dealing... weapon smuggling... and basic corruption without the use of begging to players in OOC. We have plenty of simon mcshain replicas who are so fucking stale its ruining the server

Sure, but this is more of a player problem rather than a server problem.


Blame the server that your chips aren't valuable. Blame the players who don't want to roleplay because of a scary punishment. Blame everyone lmao

Look, I'm not against Cops coming in and roughing up slummers from time to time, because of insurgents, as that poses an interesting dilemma to the slummers, "Is the resistance really your friends if they keep making your life worse?" - That, in all fairness, doesn't really get answered - But this becomes a problem when it happens:

Over
And
Over
And
OVER
Again, in the same week.

Do you not see how exhausting this becomes? Why should I log on so I can suffer my daily humiliation ritual because John Rebel thought it'd be funny to smash a camera in Triumph? That shit gets very old, VERY quickly.

I appreciate your response at least, even if you weren't being charitable.

 

[Armenian Union]

I will also speak for the loyalists. If the loyalists maybe were to be corrupt and actually coordinate more with rebels or in that case rather being a "I hate all rebels and i wont work with them" characters,

Not going to comment on your entire piece here, but I'll speak on this part as I'm familiar with the loyalist community.

There have been and are corrupt loyalists who have collaborated with insurgents/criminals. I'm not sure if you want even more of this, but that'd be up to a player to engage in.

If rebels actually wanted to make overtures to loyalists, they'd stop doing random bombings of civilian infrastructure and start distributing more punishments to the Combine rather than...the random citizens of the city. It does them no favours, nor does it want to make any loyalist collaborate with them because the resistance consistently falls into our narrative; they literally do the very thing that Combine propaganda accuses them of.

You shouldn't expect loyalists to collaborate with the resistance. If anything, the rebels should be the ones trying to do that infiltration if they used their collective hive mind for once in a while rather than doing endless shotcops.

 

[TRL]

The problems highlighted seem to be pointed more towards a rebel scene that has for the past month operated on the mechanical game as opposed to the general RP. That being said, the Partisans have largely been PKed (though under dubious circumstances). Wiping the player economy will do nothing ATM. Factoring in the fact the recent 2-week event was giving out supplies like candy, having it all be taken away immediately is like a slap in the face to everyone who bothered to participate in it.

If your problem is daily insurrections, then I'd recommend looking into the specific reasons why that occured, and how to solve it without wiping all the progress of the playerbase. For example, if you wanted to limit the gun flow into the rebel economy, sending in 8 cops to be slaughtered by the Partisans is a bad idea. Instead, maybe the OWF leads could authorize sending in player-controlled manhacks and hunters. Alternatively, they could increase the gas to the sewers, making it untenable to stay down for long periods of time.

Their solution was just giving the cops end-game rebel gear and spamming them until the Partisans died. Lame, but it worked. Now things are back to normal. No wipe needed, I want to go on an expo that isn't killing bandits for the trillionth time.

 

[Robert]

This isn't the most accurate image I made... as missing the step for Rebels doing quests, tasks, converting Credits to Chips, etc where they get slightly better-

BUT here is my low quality cycle of gear.

Btw, this encompasses like maybe 10-20% of the Rebel Scene, it was mainly partisans with all the guns, the rest are all living on scraps still.

 

[RedHotGinger]

Another factor that could contribute to gear bloat is the recent event

Aside from skill farming it also has enabled, I can assume, most of the population to gather multiple weapons via stashes, allowing for free gains towards the city.

Simply start recruiting CPs and OTA for their PvP skills so unless we wanna start doing rust monthly wipes. You'll just kill the server.

I hate this statement so much its actually hard to put into words. This server is already S2K focused. We don't need to ever suggest lowering RP quality even more, just for the sake of the low-FPS, buggy, shootouts.

If the loyalists maybe were to be corrupt and actually coordinate more with rebels or in that case rather being a "I hate all rebels and i wont work with them" characters, you could maybe do some drug dealing... weapon smuggling... and basic corruption without the use of begging to players in OOC

This is also really weird cause its pretty well-known there's alot of hidden rebels in the loyalist ranks. Or at least sympathizers. Secondly, even if this weren't the case, its really unfair for to be like, "Well if you helped us more often, maybe you too, could have fun."

In general you're being way too aggressive with this.

As for a wipe itself, I suspect we're about to have a massive uptick in gear due to the fact the last event was basically an unregulated farming simulator for most. Whether skills, or equipment. I find it very unlikely most players didn't just take the free stash opportunity and stow away a pistol or two, especially rebels who could freely access such equipment.
Not sure if a wipe is needed. I just know I don't want to have to deal with an endless barrage of meaningless shot-copping and attacks. Willard has zero balance gameplay wise, and every day is a new band-aid solution to that. Whether this is a band-aid that needs applied again, who knows.

 

[FieldersNL]

How many times we gonna repeat this?

 

[Ket]

Aside from skill farming it also has enabled, I can assume, most of the population to gather multiple weapons via stashes, allowing for free gains towards the city.

Skill farming yes, weapons not so much. Played for the entire first week and think we gained one SMG across my entire 6 man squad and a pistol lol. Sure it's more than normal but there was lots of RP. As for crafting materials, oh the economy is about to be bloated to shit.

Though in general regarding an entire wipe, it'd just repeat what happened only half a year ago at this point where it became boring. Coming from the entirely other perspective- that of the Administration and Combine, we blasted a few groups into oblivion for using their gear in a naughty manner.

In general, you can't force players into participating in being rebel-loyalists. Neither can you force people into shot-copping etc. Some players who are on the rebel side are only on the server to idle chat in slums then go shot cop for gear, akin to that of a criminal mindset rather than a resistance member. Then there's the other side that are efficiently planning stuff and trying to roleplay.

I will also speak for the loyalists. If the loyalists maybe were to be corrupt and actually coordinate more with rebels or in that case rather being a "I hate all rebels and i wont work with them"

This is a crazy take btw. Without metabaiting you have to be joking lmao.

The fact that there's little-to-no coordination from the Rebel perspective to actually you know........ Resist is crazy, essentially rebel RP is where you get off your other characters to go blow something up when you're bored. That's why there's endless amounts of gear, and that's where willard pvp comes from. Like stated above, it's all about gameplay manipulation as a rebel rather than roleplaying, a shame of course, but no one has suggested a fix for it .

If you wanted a fix, PK ACTIVE KILL ALL TRAITORS or you know... Create a roleplay culture rather than a script farming one.

 

[Eviction Notice]

Factoring in the fact the recent 2-week event was giving out supplies like candy, having it all be taken away immediately is like a slap in the face to everyone who bothered to participate in it.

Perhaps these events shouldn't hold an incentive of 'giving out supplies like candy' and instead people would turn up for the roleplay?

 

[TRL]

Perhaps these events shouldn't hold an incentive of 'giving out supplies like candy' and instead people would turn up for the roleplay?

Sure, but what we got is what we got. Our mutual want for a more RP driven mega-event doesnt have anything to do with the reality of what happened and the fact that people would be upset if they spent 2 weeks only to have all progress wiped away immediately after the fact.

 

[ford-michigan]

Create a roleplay culture rather than a script farming one.

Yes, this is what I have said. I think people need to look at what would it ICly do to the combine. It seems some people are focused on trying to defeat the combine each time they fight them then get disappointed when OTA show up. Right now rebels are not able to/not supposed to be at their end-game. They are supposed to do things that lead up, kind of like the Star Wars show Andor. Like in that show they are robbing payroll, doing jailbreaks, feeding intel to the resistance. They are not raising an army and just fighting the empire like in the main movies. Also, just because it takes time to get auths/plan things out does not mean there is an issue with the auth system. It is that way so people don't just speed through it and loot the CWU or clinic for all its stuff and then leave for no reason. It is so ET people know what is happening. And you also don't need auths for most stuff, you just got to make sure the amount of combine is met and you are not just doing it for greed.

 

[Ket]

Yes, this is what I have said. I think people need to look at what would it ICly do to the combine. It seems some people are focused on trying to defeat the combine each time they fight them then get disappointed when OTA show up. Right now rebels are not able to/not supposed to be at their end-game. They are supposed to do things that lead up, kind of like the Star Wars show Andor. Like in that show they are robbing payroll, doing jailbreaks, feeding intel to the resistance. They are not raising an army and just fighting the empire like in the main movies. Also, just because it takes time to get auths/plan things out does not mean there is an issue with the auth system. It is that way so people don't just speed through it and loot the CWU or clinic for all its stuff and then leave for no reason. It is so ET people know what is happening. And you also don't need auths for most stuff, you just got to make sure the amount of combine is met and you are not just doing it for greed.

I agree. Realistically rebels should only endgame on events and on expeditions, in server endgaming rebels is just balance breaking.

 

[NanCi_]

Skill farming yes, weapons not so much. Played for the entire first week and think we gained one SMG across my entire 6 man squad and a pistol lol. Sure it's more than normal but there was lots of RP. As for crafting materials, oh the economy is about to be bloated to shit.

Though in general regarding an entire wipe, it'd just repeat what happened only half a year ago at this point where it became boring. Coming from the entirely other perspective- that of the Administration and Combine, we blasted a few groups into oblivion for using their gear in a naughty manner.

In general, you can't force players into participating in being rebel-loyalists. Neither can you force people into shot-copping etc. Some players who are on the rebel side are only on the server to idle chat in slums then go shot cop for gear, akin to that of a criminal mindset rather than a resistance member. Then there's the other side that are efficiently planning stuff and trying to roleplay.


This is a crazy take btw. Without metabaiting you have to be joking lmao.

The fact that there's little-to-no coordination from the Rebel perspective to actually you know........ Resist is crazy, essentially rebel RP is where you get off your other characters to go blow something up when you're bored. That's why there's endless amounts of gear, and that's where willard pvp comes from. Like stated above, it's all about gameplay manipulation as a rebel rather than roleplaying, a shame of course, but no one has suggested a fix for it .

If you wanted a fix, PK ACTIVE KILL ALL TRAITORS or you know... Create a roleplay culture rather than a script farming one.

yeah ima come out and say *some* or most of my points were aggressively retarded and showed more that the rebels couldn't RP to the point of convincing some people to go corrupt. Blowing up the clinic three times really did not help in solidifying the resistances efforts in v3. Sorry about that lmao

 

[Acheif]

Stop wiping bro your already off the toilet

 

[NanCi_]

Stop wiping bro your already off the toilet

 

[M3ntal]

The gear wipe was a placebo, it wasn't a solution. Especially for players like me who just got off the ground, I'm supposed to be set back to square one because some players have endgame gear? How is that fair in any capacity?

 

[Acheif]

gear wipe won’t fix anything just put us back to terminal 7, please not again.

 

[MisterMysteryMan]

Dead thread. Stop necroing