Operation 'ZERO DAY' - Feedback Thread

[Dr. Ternith Plague]

<:: THE CITY HAS FALLEN. ::>

IN THE DARKEST HOUR,
YOU STROVE FOR ANNIHILATION.

ASHES FALL,
A FLICKER IN THE WIND

Maybe you wanted to end an era?
<:: PRIORITY ONE OBJECTIVE: FAILED. ::>
<:: ANTICITIZEN ONE TERMINATED. ::>

Maybe you tried your very best?
<:: PRIORITY ONE OBJECTIVE: SUCCESSFUL. ::>
<:: ANTICITIZEN TWO TERMINATED. ::>

Maybe you looked for a middle path?
<:: PRIORITY THREE OBJECTIVE: FAILED. ::>
<:: CRITICAL CIVIL INSURRECTION. TOTAL RENDITION AUTHORIZED. ::>

Maybe you never gave up, even at the brink?
<:: CAPTURED PROTECTION TEAM MEMBER: RESCUED. ::>

<:: TOTAL RENDITION PASSES. ::>
<:: HAMMER 4-4 IS STERILIZED. ::>
<:: FUTURISTS FLEE. ::>

<:: THE CITADEL BLASTS ITS LAST HORN. ::>
<:: FOR GOOD. ::>
​

Hello everyone! Ternith here!
I'm here to sincerely apologize for the total meltdown of communication there. There was a lot that occurred that I cannot talk about, but also plenty I can do better on. Please leave your honest review and thoughts here, and I will absolutely take it into account for my next expo when it occurs.​

 

[Tea]

I’m going to be very blunt and honest, so I will give out a disclaimer that I may sound like an asshole. That is not my intent, and it’s 4:30 am as I write this.

This expedition sounded like real fun, riot control. A concept I don’t see realized to fruition often, so I was rather excited when I found out I could attend on an O.T.A, and I love having an excuse to hop on a delegate because I enjoy it. But then everything went to total crap in the first 30 minutes due to some elements and I experienced the middle-end portion as a rioter. Let’s start off with the most obvious thing:

There was no S2RP. It was written to be S2K and S2RP based, but I personally only experienced S2K. I cannot lay hell on the GM’s for this because obviously it’s extremely difficult to organize and communicate a mass riot for S2RP actions, but I feel like that could’ve been realized and thought about before the actual expo. If it was specified to be S2K based, I think people would’ve had different perspectives and expectations.
Let me be clear, again— I was an O.T.A during the starting portion. I may not have the most clear view of this, but what I saw (and was told about) was: That cops immediately started to S2K people with live rounds after a few got downed with molotovs, which were apparently being spammed. This just made the gameplay spiral down to: Kill, especially after the bio signal loss of the MCP and OTA.

Then, towards wave 4, we were all told we’re going to be strictly S2RPing.. Until told to disregard and go back to guns blazing. It just felt like extreme crap. Perhaps I’m way too focused on the S2RP aspect, but it just felt disappointing never being able to get involved in that and forced to shoot guns. I obviously prefer and enjoy to roleplay and provide roleplay, especially after being made a rioter. But no, the shooting fest still went forward.

I was made aware this was the lead GM’s first expo/event and I honestly harbor nothing personal. It’s just that everything went completely sideways and made a lot of parties rather dissatisfied from what I know. That’s it from me, though. I did have some fun towards the end, not everything was doom.

 

[GopnikPizzafox]

Setup for the event was excellent, hype leading into it starting was great, initial setup was fantastic and the actors did a really good job on portraying the initial rioters overall.

Things only started to become less interesting when it was decided to transition into S2K over the MCP Investigator's death and the fact that they almost killed one of the units deployed seemingly early on (but likely just intended to capture, I'd be willing to back up the actors if they said they wanted to do that). I feel like the S2K portion was only meant to happen later on than it actually started and that the focus was meant to be more on trying to prevent escalation, which ultimately ended up being a failure in that regard. Whatever communication breakdown that occured, it helped contribute to this, but I thought the event was still very good overall, I just would've preferred more focus on the riot control aspects and more of a focus on S2RP and interrogating detained folks rather than the S2K focus that came fairly early on in the transition.

Ultimately, I still had fun, despite all the aforementioned issues that I'm sure a lot of other people have brought up and are going to bring up, so yeah, cool.

 

[vilhjalmrf]

I thought it was great! I died!

Serious response: The idea for this event is sound. It is certainly a different approach than to most Cop Expos. I feel as though the S2RP/S2K mixture intent was mishandled. There was no control over the action of players nor enforcement of S2RP. We dived straight into S2K and chaos as molotovs were spammed (and apparently were spawned in without the consent of the lead GM). I do not blame this on you, Tenith. You had a good intentions. There was just simply too many players to handle and I assume you were the lone GM assisting in this.

 

[Divine]

I had really, really high hopes for pushing back this whole riot civilly. I wanted to go into this as I've just seen some cool riot scenes in movies and shows, and wanted to strike the batons against the shield wall as we advanced for cool effects and sound.

And then, against the host's plan, it went pretty hectic pretty fast. I think it escalated into an S2K moshpit with little RP and regard for self-preservation as soon as molotovs went out. The rushed execution of the MCP agent and the OTA guard, which is a whole other story in its own regard, spiraled this event down the drain.

 

[BrennenW05]

As one of the actors. Was a super good event, up until the middle of the first wave. We had peak RP beforehand, and during the event. The actors we're told to respond to whatever the cop players did. If they s2rp, we s2rp. If they s2k, we s2k. When it began, none of the cop players did s2rp, so we did s2m melee hits, with a few hitting. Then it escalated into full s2k. We were given guns, but only to use in the final wave. After the cops wiped us all in wave two with SMGs. We were allowed to use said guns the rest of the expo.

As for the molotovs apparently a lot of those were thrown by a GM, and not us. But I'm going to say this. You guys were going into a riot and the idea of them using things like bottles, or molotovs shouldn't be a surprise. The decision to go full guns blazing over molotovs being thrown in a riot, and fully disregard a directive to not kill us, was an IC decision done by the CP players.

Also, one of the main objectives for the CP players was to capture the leader of the rioters. Instead of doing that, they s2ked him in the middle of doing a /me, trying to do s2rp. Leading to failing that objective.

At least from the information I know, the actors did everything we were told to do.

 

[Stanford]

Let me start off by saying I absolutely loved the atmosphere. You made good use of scene building as well as making the city feel alive by not only using actors but also NPCs, which I've never seen done successfully before, so bravo on that.

I feel like this expedition did not go as you intended however. Is it possible that a number of GMs came to assist but did things without your prior consent?

One of the main issues is obviously that this turned into an s2k fest. From the start we were bombarded with molotovs and one of the civpro was beaten and dragged off, as well as certain other events... This left very little opportunities to do actual roleplay.

At the end of the day however I found that the entire concept of this expedition alongside its atmosphere as well as the story were really well put together. Had there been no molotovs I do believe this would have not spiraled into what it turned out to be. I hope that you do not feel discouraged after everything that happened and I'm looking forward to future expeditions from you.

 

[tsaoT]

The scenebuilding was quite wonderful. That shit looked like a fucking mess, it was a fucking mess in-lore, and it perfectly laid the groundwork of things. People act similarly to their environment; a worse-looking place will have people acting sloppier and more ragged, which happened.

There was no possible way you could have known, being largely on the outside, what certain players would do or act like, however it's something to keep in-consideration for the future regarding who partakes (as both an Actor and Player) to determine whether they're the right fit for your expedition.

The mass-deployment of molotovs was, obviously, the breaking point just due to their sheer effectiveness. When the MCP Inspector and an OTA member went down immediately, nevermind the fact we still had a Command Unit missing, it signals to CPs that the situation is far more violent and extreme than expected, so they immediately had to escalate- far quicker than they expected, too. As the Command Unit who called for lethal force first I was saying that practically only to my PT originally, given we had no idea what the state of the Train Station was; if we have to push back there, we're not going to be gentle about it, damn the consequences.

There is one thing to be said of 'it's to be expected that molotovs are present' but consideration must also be made for the fact this is a Source Engine game. Transcribing it entirely to reality is going to result in a negative outcome, and it did result in a negative outcome. Incendiaries, especially in cramped conditions, are extremely overly-effective compared to reality. One hitting you directly will result in a down; and if you're already injured then even just running near it could do so, too.

That, however, is simply my defense of the rapid switch to lethal force, and not a discussion of anything else.

All the same, I personally enjoyed it. Not gonna do something like provide a score. I simply enjoyed it; I would partake again, and the ideal will be that the outcome here provides some new and interesting ideas for future expeditions.

Which I shall also gladly participate in

 

[Deadnoise]

As a scenebuilder, i can say without hesitation that this was some great scenebuilding. Everything looked and felt like the city was a hot mess, and i loved it. Ive never took part in a riot setting before so i was hyped to experience this expo.

Sadly things did indeed get out of hand really quickly at the end of wave 1, and it all went downhill from there. The usage of molotovs was the tipping point. While i was able to do some RP with the CP's, i felt that trying to perform S2RP with this many players was just not going to work.

If the molotovs were used more in an attempt to keep the CP's from pushing too far into an area too quickly rather then outright attack them it could have allowed things to cool down for a bit and let the admins catch up.

Despite these's drawbacks i still had fun playing as a rioter, and i hope that the lead GM is able to come up with more expos in the future.

 

[nora]

urban expos like this are rare and riots even rarer. watching a city crumble under its own weight and infighting was much more interesting and compelling than the reasons other cities fell. the atmosphere, @Dej's dispatch broadcasts, the propping and map itself were all amazing.

on another note, the rapid escalation into s2k after the first wave sucked. having to manage 4 rioters alone with a riot shield alone while the rest of my team was picking up our downed command unit was nerve wracking, it was great, i wish we remained nonlethal and mere riot control at least for another wave. to see all of it disappear so quickly because of the actions of a few bad roleplayers was disappointing.

even then, though, i still enjoyed it due to the interactions with the other units. arguing whether or not we should go back to save 380, then deciding to be a hostage negotiator with 240, etc, was all unique and fun roleplay i had and i'm glad i got to experience it. the immediate aftermath on main was also real fun.

overall, i think things ought to be more tightly controlled and outlined for all of us in the next expo, especially if its organized in such a specific manner like a riot.

 

[0xNiklas]

The environment was peak, the ambience was great. - So was the propping itself, as I imagined this would a city look like, If it comes down to shit. In the background to hear BSLs lost of NPC units also supported this feeling of total redemption is near.

Unfortunately, I have not much to say and rather more negatively. As I missed over half the event out and expectations weren't met.

1. My Captivity
Captivity is a good thing, especially as CP. It gives you a role reverse to feel the brutality of imprisonment, which you yourself commit to your next kin. But captivity can be only fun, when the warden makes it fun. Being forced to AFK somewhere until you get freed, ransomed or find an opportunity to escape isn't that much enjoyable during an event. If you intend on taking prisoners from the players, make sure you have something to do for them or make them still engage in the event than to wait the event out.

2. The S2RP / S2k mess
My advice on this, knowing you weren't at fault of this and the event escalated to a mess. Because either miscommunication or because of some rogue auth, alternatively being it the broken ammo with the shotguns.

If you host an event, then that's YOUR event. You get the blame and praise for everything, especially when helping GMs are sabotaging your event. Your own kingdom, which you have to rule with an iron fist to keep the event rolling as intended.

I encourage you personally to do another riot event, as you get the right idea- But just with the improvement on how the actors will behave and be portrait.

Make use of the /event command, to tell people to stop or what they should do. You should take lead in these moments to avoid these catastrophic moments where all hell goes loose. Having the GMs split up to supervise the two PTs and rioters in their hand to hand combat.


And if people are acting out of line and are slowly sabotaging the event, remove them from your event.