Realism != Fun (sometimes)

[Ruairidh]

If you can only have fun with a gun, perhaps find other ways to have fun with your characters so all your characters don't end up with the same goal. If you're only here for the guns, maybe you're just in the wrong gamemode.

You see if you read what I said I stated "Key words, rifle and rebel" and if that wasnt obvious I also stated, "rifle toting rebel". Now you see after analysing this I never said "muh you only have fun when you using gun" and I also never said that it had to be across all characters, you see I used the word choice of rebel as I felt that you would understand that a rebel may want a gun to do rebel activities however I feel it has gone way over your head.

If BMDs are too rare for you (which they absolutely aren't)... Become one. Or, don't be so dependant on what they sell. People don't buy anything that isn't weapons anyway. And I've -lived- that so no excuses there. People would rather pay 8000 chips for an SVD than 500 for a materials kit that literally builds them any base anywhere. Or any other RP-good items like disguises or tools. Again, I have -seen- this happen.

Yes I shall simply just become one, or better yet I shall show excellent RP by asking any rebel I find if they know of a BMD or if they are one! That shows great RP! And you say dont be so dependant, well I do have news for you, BMDs are a gap, they serve as true progression as eventually you will hit a standstill where you cannot craft the higher end gear, surprisingly BMDs can provide that! I know! Shocker! Also people paying 8K for an SVD? Yeah that does not surprise me the current rebels (some not all cba putting that into the sentence) are like that however in their defence there arent really any bases to find as they are either locked or just a shitty location.

If you die, you accept death and move on instead of whining about being too oppresed, or too outnumbered, or meta, or whatever the monthly excuse becomes, maybe it means you just made a mistake which almost noone seems to consider ever. Starting a story without the intent of finishing it means there is no story happening at all anyway. Dying is part of the game. If you're gonna avoid it at all costs and play this shit like it's singleplayer skyrim, again, maybe you should consider what you are doing playing in the server.

You arent really tackling my point here, my point wasnt "I dont wanna die with all my shit" the point was and get this, trust me bro it is actually insane what I am about to say next, my point was if we make shit easier to get then rebels wont really be as scared of dying with all their shit as they know that they wont have to grind glue or explosives or the next easy to grind thing, however I shant dash your points as some thought did go into them however it was a swing and a miss as you tackled the wrong point, however there is effort and I can give props for that.

If literally your only gist is going out on expeditions which you know you will succeed in because eventmakers rarely fuck you over, then maybe don't have your organizations' mottos be 'fighting for freedom' (or similar), instead just be a bunch of ragtag hoarders ICly, not just OOCly. It's so incoherent and inconsistent when ya hear people be like "yeah I fight opression" with their only goal being cashing in on chips and having a big sniper rifle they never use not to lose it (except if it's NPCs which cannot realistically kill you back! then ofc it's time ot be the big hero). It's like a cringe fashion show tbh. Like what, I am meant to believe you are cooler or more developed because you have better gear? The CP have been bored to death and the CT have broken their heads trying to keep us entertained because none of you had left the base(s) in the last 2 months. One half of the recipe is outright just missing.

I cannot bash you on the ease of getting good shit from expeditions, no matter how long they take to set up they do still give really op shit (majority of the time) I cannot also bash you on those who flash their shit as that is a problem HOWEVER you are looking at the rebels who actually have shit and the rebels who are literally scrapping the bottom of the barrel for shit, the people are able to flash their shit off because they know that people have nothing, the economy is fucked. Props to the russian rebel who actually does shit bro he is a legend.

I don't even know what to tell you here. It is so astronomically wrong and out of touch. You do know CPs are players, too, right? Just like anti civs? I think the difference here radicates in the fact CP has an OOC player filter and the faction is fairly more curated, so are the people in it. You mean you don't talk to people because they can't be trusted? Sounds like a you problem. And while on the topic 'secret metabases' should be prohibited. You wanna live in the IZ, then you don't get a out of jail free card. With risks come consequences.

Firstly, I do know CPs are players again I think what I said went right over your head, CPs have people that they can actually rely on and are in contact with, I am sorry for not being clear with what I first said. I do want to talk to rebels however, they are either never around, they are too busy grinding OR they are "hur dur I am a cool rebel who doesnt want to talk to you, your gear is nothing like mine (either better or worse)". And I never said metabases should be prohibited I just quite frankly think they are underused and it would be cooler if they were used to plan shit (which in some cases they are). Yeah next time I shall go full G.O. and make shit alot easier to understand.

Literally my first post in this thread says the endless grind is not necessary because scripts aren't necessary (surprise). As for the rest, again, it's an IC issue, biproduct of having bad characters AND bad players in your faction(s). Like, how am I supposed to tell you this? ...Get better at establishing social links? At building a character? All while being careful? Be original? Leave notes?

I know there are groups that do this for a fact so the fact you don't (and the majority don't) just means you most of you lot simply don't roleplay resistance properly. Independently of all the problems surrounding it, which might be more or less true to whichever extent.

Ok then, if scripts arent necessary, remove the knockdown function on the CP stunsticks all together, remove the armbands, remove all the foods as lets be honest who really needs it just add some basic foods and just RP what the food actually is, remove all the guns lol we can just RP shooting (switch to M9K?) remove grenades lets be real we can just RP that too, hell remove most of the clothing we can just RP most of it, Might aswell remove all the drinks really just have one bottle prop that gives thirst and a can prop that gives thirst, etc. etc. The whole "scripts arent needed for rp" argument is pretty dumb tbh, I have only seen it on THIS rp server ONLY THIS ONE all the other servers that I have played on have done really well in making items factor into rp, such a shame this server couldnt. And yes bro I am bad because players dont want to talk, I am bad because of people in my group and yes I am bad for trying a fairly unique RP idea I guess you could call it. Your note suggestion however is actually pretty good and once main server comes back I will actually try it out as it is not something I have thought of and yes I do agree that not alot of rebels roleplay as rebels tbh they can fight their battles really hopefully most of them have a reason as to why they never leave their bases and shit.

 

[VelmaDingus]

Rebels stay permanently in the IZ looting the same 10 trashbags after they note down their spawnpoints and respawn timers,

Which is exactly what Travis is condemning. This grind is constantly needed to supply ammo.

Civil Protection can literally have most items dispensed for free and in limitless supply.

Exactly! Rebels do not have this convenience. We have to grind out our ammo, which yes, is realistic, we're less equipped than Civil Protection, got it, but being reminded of that CONSTANTLY by having to grind for hours on end each day is really frustrating, and limits the time I get to spend actually RPing.

In order to get ammo as a rebel (grinding) or ammo as a cp (vending) you don't have to roleplay, but for one group? It's spending a few hours doing a repetitive RP-less action. For the other? Dispensed immediately.

It makes a lot of rebel players experience pretty severe burn out, because all they're doing is hold ctrl+E for hours a day, even when their character doesn't die, because they need ammo, or equipment for their recruits, etc.

the reason why stuff is hard to get for the rebels is because every time they get them 90% abuse it

Well, that's not a deterrent, really. You just end up with extremely structured and focused groups that grind for this stuff to then abuse it.

It doesn't fix the issue, it just prevents all but the most dedicated trolls and cheaters from abusing it... And prevents all but the most dedicated players from getting to play rebel, and then gives them CRAZY burn out if they lose their character, because it'll take days upon days to even get to the point where you can engage in any significant rebel events and stuff.

Yeah, RP is still there, you don't need a gun, but good luck underground, good luck trying to do a bounty, etc etc.

consider continuing to play on the most risky faction of the gamemode.

Not about the risk, it's about the slog.

You have a loyalist character who dies? Oh fuck, you have to grind workshifts, man, there goes a fucking week, goddamn it... But at least it's done after that. You max out SC. Yeah, you have to jump through a lot of hoops to get T4, and it's annoying, but you're done with the grind.

Rebels have to continue grinding for as long as they want to keep their position. Guns run out of ammo, armor runs out durability, you run out of meds, etc etc. Easing up that grind a little is all that's being asked for here. It's kinda fuckin' ridiculous how little you get, unless you are willing to grind out hours upon hours of looting trash and containers.

It's not helping with rebel RP, it's just making sure the top dogs with the most gear and shit? They're the kinda people who can stand weeks upon weeks of grind. Maybe they're a good roleplayer, maybe they're shit? Doesn't matter, they're there before they're willing to put their nose on the grindstone and hold ctrl and e, first and foremost.

Everything else is secondary.




I understand maybe it needs to be vetted somehow. Consider a vendor that supplies stuff cheap and easily (like for CPs) that you have to be whitelisted for.

Rebel isn't a faction that is whitelisted, in this instance. Access to the easy resupplies is whitelisted, to good roleplayers with a proven track record, so they can minimize grind and maximize RP time.

Can even put a daily supply limit on it, like with the DoB or something.

 

[VelmaDingus]

I'd also like to add; it's not even necessarily the time spent doing it.

It's that it's not good.

Realistically, our characters would have to scavenge for ammo, sure, but the way we have to do it on the server? It's uninteresting. Spending a lot of time doing something that isn't entertaining is really frustrating. It'd be like if we had a sleep meter as well as hunger and thirst, and had to just lie in bed for a few minutes every hour we play on the server.

The loyalist grind at least contains RP, in the way of CWU shifts, which are... Very hit and miss, yes, but still actually roleplayed.
The Civil Protection grind is based on completing certain actions, which you roleplay.
The rebel material grind is... Ctrl+e.

This grind is devoid of RP, unentertaining, and time-consuming.

On a roleplay server, that's not a good sign, right? We can all agree on that, surely?

Even if it gates off "optional" RP, like having armor or a gun, that's still gating off RP... That some people want to engage in.

 

[HadeZord]

Even if it gates off "optional" RP

that's still gating off RP...

The one thing I feel I should add to this thread is this... rebels are gatekept from the ''higher resistance chain'' RP... Vorts that havent gotten to tier 1 are literally gatekept from ALL RP, theoretically any CP can stop a vortigaunt below tier 1 from SPEAKING to someone unless it's for a work related matter, from ROLEPLAYING in the RP server... Oh and also they can literally stick you inside the designated biotic housing and apparently you aren't allowed to LEAVE until tier 1, you only leave if someone REMEMBERS YOU'RE THERE, to summon you for work, a huge shoutout to the entire CP faction for not enforcing this garbage, And the cherry on top? Vorts get 1 SC out of shifts instead of 3, which makes this 20 SC a fucking extraordinary slog to get trough, Once again it boils down to the same issue, all new chars have to deal with an arbitrary grind to get a certain degree of ''freedom of RP'', Everytime I think about the fact if I want to make a new char after It'Er's death I need to go trough that grind again? I literally grow sick to my stomach from thinking I'll have to do it, and it's fucking MANDATORY FOR MY WL... So yeah im horrified of It'Er's death, not just because he's by far the singular best character I ever came up with? But because of the arbitrary and horrid SC grind for a vort to be allowed to do basically ANYTHING... Also the biotic reform just... in general is dogshit but that's another point.
I hope im at least providing good enough RP for the server even with my constant and absurd fear of a PK

 

[VelmaDingus]

rebels are gatekept from the ''higher resistance chain'' RP.

100%. You get to do rebel RP, just not certain parts of it. Vorts are excluded from a lot of even passive RP, if they're tier 1.

Vorts that havent gotten to tier 1 are literally gatekept from ALL RP

Don't speak unless spoken to. Very in universe law, makes sense ICly, very uninteresting in terms of RP, is stupid OOCly.
Maybe make it so that they have to stop talking to a human who tells them too, not just a blanket ban on speech.

Vorts get 1 SC out of shifts instead of 3

I would not wish 20 CWU workshifts on my worst enemy, lol. Vorts get 20 SC from that, humans get 60 SC.

new chars have to deal with an arbitrary grind to get a certain degree of ''freedom of RP''

If you want to roleplay as a Vort who is treated as a slave, and isn't allowed to talk to people? Cool! Have fun! But especially for Vort players, who are whitelisted and heavily vetted, I think being able to pick your tier (maybe up to a certain level) is kind of in order.

Let those who enjoy the grind grind, and let those who think the idea of that kind of roleplay is mindnumbing skip it... because it's not the RP they applied to do, OOCly.

 

[Vulpes Callida]

Let those who enjoy the grind grind, and let those who think the idea of that kind of roleplay is mindnumbing skip it... because it's not the RP they applied to do, OOCly.

Honestly, no. There's a million games out there to grind, why do they have to do it on a roleplay server? It's coincidentally the same people who complain nothing ever happens or that "odds are too stacked against them". The grind is bad exactly because of these people who power through it senselessly and with no roleplay. If we didn't have exploiters who do the trash cycle in circles for hours and have containers full of everything, I'm pretty sure the crafting reqs would be much more forgiving (as much as I despise crafting).

The one thing I feel I should add to this thread is this... rebels are gatekept from the ''higher resistance chain'' RP... Vorts that havent gotten to tier 1 are literally gatekept from ALL RP, theoretically any CP can stop a vortigaunt below tier 1 from SPEAKING to someone unless it's for a work related matter, from ROLEPLAYING in the RP server...

The entire vort faction is a mess as it stands and the new vortigaunt decree or whatever it is called by the CCA is so anti-player it hurts. Single handedly went from seeing 2-3 vorts a day to absolute 0. I would go on a tangent about how vorts are cucked from every side but I think we all know by now.

This grind is devoid of RP, unentertaining, and time-consuming.

I'm pretty sure it was made like this so it could be 'automated' and not require admin supervision/avoiding excessive admin loot spawns, and to also slow down people who will do anything to reach endgame in 1 day. I'm not saying I agree with it, but it is how it is given the current players who use the system. If the current state of the rebels says anything is that no matter what they might obtain most of them still do nothing. They only ever use explosives because it's stuff they can detonate and run.

Problem is more in the mentality and conception than the systems. Person above us is literally saying 'remove all the scripts' because I said scripts aren't necessary like it's an argument because he can't have it his way, and has replied 'they are too busy grinding to roleplay' to every single answer he demanded as to how to roleplay better. Like you can't make it up. It's the guy who also tried to 'medically' argue with me for like 3 pages worth of post that adrenaline made you able to take bullets like terminator.

It's like people fail to separate the two things. I'm not saying a gun might not be necessary for (X) development, but... The fact each of you need to be more armed than the pentagon to feel the confidence to try anything instead of getting witty like some other rebels have is quite sad. On top of this, it's also concerning just how many of the rebel-sided players do not understand what it means to be a rebel character. Like... You -chose- a life of misery in exchange for freedom... That's the entire premise. You are not an army. You won't have steady supplies of stuff unless you work for them. And onto that note... :

If you need scripts, I am sure literally anyone in the CT will set something up for you, even serverside. That's what expeditions are literally for, and they happen very regularly; so I'm surprised 'the grind' is the main argument when you are already partaking in other ways to (way too) consistently get (way too good) supplies.

Rebels have to continue grinding for as long as they want to keep their position. Guns run out of ammo, armor runs out durability, you run out of meds, etc etc. Easing up that grind a little is all that's being asked for here. It's kinda fuckin' ridiculous how little you get, unless you are willing to grind out hours upon hours of looting trash and containers.

This is, honestly, untrue. Unless admins are being mean and mingy and spawning way too many NPCs in the sewers, the rebel groups have done nothing to warrant the usage of ammunition or armour for the past two months (save expeditions, where they get a net positive of everything, anyway). You have safespots in the IZ where you can also stay indefinitely without the use of filters. Meds are only really necessary in the case of injury, which, all things considered in the previous statement shouldn't be as common.

You know easy ways to get supplies? Raiding the CWU, stealthily. Emptying the stock of a shop (instead of burning them for no reason). But that has a risk, so can't do it, can we. You only do it if it's versus NPCs in an area where there can't be any realistic answer or response. It's back to the risk free trashbag collection and expeditions. There is so little originality most of the time. I can count the rebels who dare even mix in with the populace and take a little bit more of a risk just observing with one hand. Rest are just perma-offboundaries (then complain they never interact with anyone).

The CWU container has so much shit in it you could single handedly craft a Star Destroyer out of how long it has been without seeing a raid (unless they emptied it) but you people still try and convince me these people's only way to survive is by pressing CTRL+E? No, just... Roleplay. Stop trying to take the easy way out. Organise? Stop having sixteen million small groups of 4-5 people each, where it's a gamble whether you all are online at the same time or not. All of the problems that have been stated (lack of trust between rebel players, not finding anyone to interact with...) are not consequences of the crafting system, but consequences of terrible player org, IC and OOC. It's you people who rat eachother out for benefits and infight to see who is the 'real resistance' or 'best group'... That has nothing to do with 'realism' or 'grinding'.

Also, other factions too have to do maintenance. Perhaps not as severe, but that is why CP, for example, is an ICly reasonable alternative. That said, as I have said numerous times in this post, I'm against "infinite supply dispensers".

The rebel experience is miserable and while certainly it has to do with some systems in play like you say they're ultimately a consequence of the stuff that's been done by the anti-civ players. I'm all for changing systems but like many others have said the same thing will happen, because the systems are contributors but not causes of the problem.

 

[Ruairidh]

Well, that's not a deterrent, really. You just end up with extremely structured and focused groups that grind for this stuff to then abuse it.

this is true especially when talking about the glue situation

 

[M3ntal]

I can speak from experience as a rebel player that getting more gear easier is not a good solution. I got absolutely fucking stacked on chips, ammo, weapons, everything. And I had nothing to do for weeks, which is why I purely roleplayed on my vortigaunt at the time (partly due to the fact that I wanted to develop my vort).

I've abandoned that mindset of only thinking practicality in terms of items. I do quests for items that aren't just weapons. I helped a vort in an attempt to do a ritual. I provided supplies, a lot of medical supplies to someone, with no benefit to myself. I try to be generous with my scripts and my items because in order to foster capabilty, people have to work together.

And most of the rebels don't squat in the sewers anymore, either. Maybe some do, what with the addition of the new item crates, but the item crates aren't an end all be all. Just a convenience for people, at most.

So, overall, it's best to focus not on gear, but on interaction. I know that this basically amounts to me adding nothing to the discussion, but I wanted to provide a perspective as a somewhat prominent rebel figure (at least I assume that Rice is a relatively well known rebel)

 

[HadeZord]

If you want to roleplay as a Vort who is treated as a slave, and isn't allowed to talk to people? Cool! Have fun! But especially for Vort players, who are whitelisted and heavily vetted, I think being able to pick your tier (maybe up to a certain level) is kind of in order.

I can only fucking wish... If I was capable of just making a vort and having him at tier 2 instantly? Boom, I begin to work on things I want to do, apply for whichever union I want to try and don't have to deal with a slog of RP that simply isn't fun...

You know easy ways to get supplies?

How about I add my two cents to this...
Maybe an advice to people who think the trashbags are the only way to get what you want... At least from my experience? I got everything I wanted with It'Er and never once stepped foot in the sewers because I CANT be there, so I had to get creative...

DOB AND VENDING MACHINES FOLKS
The holy grail of legal ''contraband''
''But it's tracked trough the POS!''
And? Why's that a problem? Just buy things in a manner that isn't stupid, I've once heard from the DOB director that some random came into a shop and asked for 20 saturated flour and 20 vinegar........ Yeah no wonder people only think the trashbags work, when you try to make a purchase like that...
Buy things in a manner that makes sense, be SLOW about it, don't buy 40 fucking supplies all of a sudden, space it out, play the long game, do you need vegetable packages for boosters? Buy them alongside an equal amount of vinegar, anyone asks you were just making pickled vegetables, hell buy a cooking knife for good measure just to drive the point home, just make purchases that MAKE SENSE and you'll have no issue with your transactions being tracked and you'll have your materials as a result.

When any shop is open that is, but that's another point

As for vending machines? THAT is where it's at, you can't track WHO bought something from a vending machine, so you can just buy a bunch of seemingly legal items and then turn them to contraband without being tracked for it, Hell you might even BE the person that OWNS the machine and set it up in such a way that you can sell the stuff to the population, those that want to buy it just to use it normally? Sure go ahead, it's still money for you, for the more... Cunniving... of your clients... they'll know how to use what you sell.

Since I couldn't do the ''meta'' grind... I had to find my own way, and I guarantee you I've had more fun doing it this way that any rebel ever had doing it ''effectively'', But don't just go by what I said, use your imagination! join the CMU and ask for supplies for yourself!, abuse permits! Raid the CWU warehouse! The server is your canvas, and it changes with your actions so make them COUNT.

 

[George]

Damn, people really writing a lot into this

 

[HadeZord]

Damn, people really writing a lot into this

It's important to talk about so ye we just vibin

 

[George]

It's important to talk about so ye we just vibin

Alright I can sum it up for everyone to save them reading.

I am right, everyone else is wrong.

 

[Rabid]

I don't mean to sound catty but the goalposts will forever move as people try to justify why they're not doing things even when given what they want. The staff team have probably already seen this cycle repeat over the past year too.

"If we just had more guns..."
"If we just had more ammo..."
"If we just had secret bases..."
"If we just had less sweeps..."
"If we just has equal PK's..."
"If we just didn't have to grind as much..."
"If we just didn't have as harsh PK rules..."

Don't get me wrong; I understand that The Resistance is not a faction in the same way Civil Protection is and so there's not a unified opinion but equally I've seen all of these arguments made time and time again with assurances that if this is changed that it will change everything and people will absolutely do more of x or y.

Universally this ends up not being the case and we're back to the races.

 

[John Rico]

To give rebels some credit, what are they even supposed to do? All ways of 'rebellion' will either get you clowned or won't bear any consequences at all
>you attack cops, you're a shotcopper
>you target RDT or any other civilian building, you're a terrorist
>you attack the Nexus (lol), you die
>you attack secondary combine targets like generators or the checkpoint, they're back up in no time and no real damage was done in the meantime
>you go the pacifist route and try building a roleplay hub in Indigent like the homeless shelter, you're getting bullied and the whole building is set on fire every other week
>considering all this, you just keep it safe and stay in your safe spot because there is no incentive to do anything anyway, everyone calls you a hoarder

That's why the closest I've ever been to having a rebel character is doing an non-conformist citizen, but even then, you can only really decide to not snitch on rebels or hoard credits without sucking CP dick.
Like I said in the last rebel ranting thread, you're not changing rebel mentality without fixing the setting and giving them some tangible objectives.

 

[Ruairidh]

To give rebels some credit, what are they even supposed to do? All ways of 'rebellion' will either get you clowned or won't bear any consequences at all
>you attack cops, you're a shotcopper
>you target RDT or any other civilian building, you're a terrorist
>you attack the Nexus (lol), you die
>you attack secondary combine targets like generators or the checkpoint, they're back up in no time and no real damage was done in the meantime
>you go the pacifist route and try building a roleplay hub in Indigent like the homeless shelter, you're getting bullied and the whole building is set on fire every other week
>considering all this, you just keep it safe and stay in your safe spot because there is no incentive to do anything anyway, everyone calls you a hoarder

That's why the closest I've ever been to having a rebel character is doing an non-conformist citizen, but even then, you can only really decide to not snitch on rebels or hoard credits without sucking CP dick.
Like I said in the last rebel ranting thread, you're not changing rebel mentality without fixing the setting and giving them some tangible objectives.

true

 

[Vulpes Callida]

To give rebels some credit, what are they even supposed to do? All ways of 'rebellion' will either get you clowned or won't bear any consequences at all
>you attack cops, you're a shotcopper
>you target RDT or any other civilian building, you're a terrorist
>you attack the Nexus (lol), you die
>you attack secondary combine targets like generators or the checkpoint, they're back up in no time and no real damage was done in the meantime
>you go the pacifist route and try building a roleplay hub in Indigent like the homeless shelter, you're getting bullied and the whole building is set on fire every other week
>considering all this, you just keep it safe and stay in your safe spot because there is no incentive to do anything anyway, everyone calls you a hoarder

That's why the closest I've ever been to having a rebel character is doing an non-conformist citizen, but even then, you can only really decide to not snitch on rebels or hoard credits without sucking CP dick.
Like I said in the last rebel ranting thread, you're not changing rebel mentality without fixing the setting and giving them some tangible objectives.

While not wrong, what people ask for is cohesion mostly.
>If an assassination makes sense, feel free to shoot the cop; but during my time here the admittedly few attacks I have seen have been at random. I know it's already in the works, but identifying high prio targets in the CP and CCA and getting rid of them is definitely something the rebels should do.
>Why in the world would you ever target civilian infrastructure?
>Yeah I kinda hate the plot armor on 'bases' in general, Nexus included ("10291 ota would be inside!!" is the same argument as "c24 cant fall its loyalist city!!" its just boring)
>Generators are more civilian infrastructure since they power housing - everything combine works on separate grids, for the most part. And yeah - those strikes have to be done with a purpose. Perhaps you want that checkpoint down for a week to do something else? Just senselessly hitting it is... Useless. This isn't an ubisoft game.
>IDK why people hated so much on the homeless shelter, I loved it. And at least during my playtime, unsure before, all fires have been caused by anti-citizens (more dmg to civilian infrastructure).
>There are many incentives, many rebels do very cool things. Be them being incognito in shops or having food giveaways with the poor in indigent. That's just an excuse, tbh.

I did speak with Nyx and someone else in private about another major issue: the fact external factors don't allow the roleplay to grow on an OOC level such as mindsets and attitudes, but also overreaches by surrounding factions.

I've been fairly irrationally mad in this thread (I blame it on me being sick, but I take responsibility) so for that I apologise, but besides the god-awful crafting system, are there things being done by other (primarily opposing) factions that make your life too impossible, and if so, which? Because it'd be foolish to ignore the fact the non-crims might also be being cucked by outside forces.

What do you people think of the "BOL" system for example? Or, the amount of cameras and forcefields?

Personally, I think the 'crimes' section of the CP need a rework or at the very least some clarification. Another way to help perhaps is not making it so every 'catch' means 'death'. That said, many of you are already in tight waters, be it for carelessness or because the system is far too strict.

I think that's more in line with the original meaning of the post. Since there is clearly no intent by the devs to change crafting, perhaps the factions can mold to make the environment more enjoyable? @Travis

 

[Deleted member 4096]

A few weeks ago I ended up making a thread called 'Rebel Ramblings' about this in how I input my perspective on how parameters influence behaviours. Because that there's little OOC bridging communication on player-to-player and usually any effort of creating such scenes would be compromised under the 'metagaming' clause and there's no differentiation between good-faith and bad-faith encounters result in the players not wanting to interact with their antagonist factions for fear of losing both the character they've developed and accoutrements involved.

I think it still stands. Although it could be considered awry from most people's viewpoint.