Decline in RP Standards | Inappropriate RP

[MazuzaM]

GOOD EVENING LADS WHO ARE READING THIS

Have you perhaps noticed, especially if you are a long standing player in your community, that the server seriousness and Roleplay standards are going down the bin?

Does your experience even less dystopian than what it used to be? I will list every issue with the majority of the Factions as I witnessed first hand:

Citizens:
This is a mixed pot, there's some people who roleplay accordingly but it's a minority in confront to what I have seen.

- There is absolutely no sense or recognition of the situation you are in (20+ years of constant slavery, labour and malnutrition) and people tend to act the way they would in real life, directly breaking the rules under the FailRP Section

"------------- A character's / behaviour and view of the world should match the scale and sense of the world they're living in, not real life."

Civil Protection:
I'm sorry to say this, as a Civpro main, I am afraid that this faction is the one that had the biggest decline in RP Standards, there are so many problems in my opinion and others:

- Metrocops feel like high school bullies, there is no real surgical protocol to follow to interact with Citizens or preserve conversations in public. I feel Starboat bait is part of this problem.

- The idea of a kind Metrocop (Which is overdone) should be rarely done and more punished by Command. No, I'm not saying that your cop should be a sadic that finds pleasure in hurting other people, but keep in mind you passed years of indocrination no matter what if your character chooses a path in the Civil Protection, they should be displayed more surgically rather than some 70s cop in Brooklyn.

ESPECIALLY the problem resides with some Rank Leaders, they recieve the same Memory replacement as Transhumans, the guide clearly states that they should be feared yet they act like some cool coaches for the units and fail to make you feel oppressed.

Resistance:
I've also played the Resistance, RP Hubs are enjoyable but the problem still lingers with inappropriate Roleplay for characters as they are:
- Self Proclaimed Warriors and fearless fighers
- Semi Serious Minges who only play to S2K (Fewer minority)

Before you say ha ha here's the fun police, no, there's ways of enjoying Roleplay by doing it accordingly, this is what Willard HL2RP should be, not a sitcom of silly jokes and corny actions to get on the Starboard.

 

[Rabid]

Stop pretending you're playing real cops

Honestly this only furthers his (and my) point - because you are right, they're not real cops and wouldn't have standards at all.

If a cop decides to chat with a citizen, who'd realistically give a shit about it? They are citizens pulled off the streets, thrown into a uniform and told "keep the peace however you want because you have the power to." Its debatable whether or not they even have any true complex laws at all.

They definately don't have a HR department people could complain to about their conduct and The Combine wouldn't care, so long as nobody is starting an Uprising.

You are surviving off of anti-fatigue rations and pure adrenaline. You have been shot, beaten up, whailed-on, insulted, and nearly killed several times over. You have no humanity and you have no morality. You are inherently ammoral. The mask is your face and you have become your mask. You have become your job.

See my above post, but this is only within the framework that HL2RP has to justify having an armed resistance sitting in the slums/sewers who shoot at cops in the middle of the city, which is wildly out of whack for the time period Willard (and every other HL2RP server tbh) is trying to portray.

As seen in the opening of HL2, Most inner-city CP's wouldn't do much more than raid apartments as their most interesting thing that week. Maybe arrest someone for a fight or deal with a drunk. Not be in semi-open war with insurgents.

 

[Cavity]

Picture this:

One day, you are playing, and then you get the passion to make a loyalist character! .... and then you wake up.

Take a step back and realize that, given how Willard Networks Civil Protection operates, it's unrealistic for anyone to be loyal to the Combine in this server. The way Civil Protection operates and its unusually cruel treatment of the civilian population make it impossible for such things to happen. The server should make rules for Civil Protection to be more empathetic and caring to citizens, so people ACTUALLY WANT TO PLAY AS NORMAL CITIZENS.

 

[Ket]

The problem with CivPro roleplay standards currently is a lot of the playerbase or at least the ones that enter the limelight are playing to get a reaction rather than to act out a character. You could argue it'd be the same for any faction on the server, but currently we're only debating CivPro.

There's not really any guide I can see about how the server wants the general beatcop to act, unlike OTA, Vort etc. It's sort of just a case of, get thrown in and copy those around you, by which are already setting a bad example. If you wanted to fix it, de-whitelist the people intentionally going after OOC reactions and starboard bait and you'd have solved the problem.

My idea of the perfect CivPro would be to have some wits but also knowing that if they aren't doing their job, their family cohesion is on the line. So you know- you'd be an asshole. But regulations and procedures tell you who to be an asshole to based on the situation, ie not being an asshole to every collaborator you see or every civi you see, but entirely scenario based.

The Combine would expect some sort of uniformity in the way their Civil Protection are designed and supposed to act. There's a reason for memory replacement and the cause of it is for a number of reasons. CivPro are technically about as oppressed as the citizen population is, but they receive more benefits. The Combine play a lot on the humanity side of the human psyche, it's not meant to be enjoyable for anyone.

Then you break into the actual Roleplay side of it, which needs to be made enjoyable for each player involved. At a Collaborator level, we try and do different things and open up the range in which is possible to make the role more appealing and enjoyable long term. For Citizen, it's merely a new player/working role where you are in it until you achieve where you want to go, whether it be a union/ministry/rebel/collaborator/civpro etc. This doesn't mean that CivPro should be acting weird or out of character for any reason though, which directly relates back to starboard baiting/playing for a reaction.

If people understood what role they had applied for then they'd probably play it better, but instead we have a case of throwing people in and learning from others who're already doing what we're complaining about. I'd be all for CivPro having a blast behind the curtains within the Nexus, but out on the streets where you're supposed to be an oppressive force, players should be advocating for that gritty style of play rather than the "hey-ho citizen, what're you a fuckin' ugly guy or what haha." There's always room for character development, but there's little to ZERO impact on players who go out of their way to break the atmosphere the faction is supposed to bring.

Basically, punish bad players through de-whitelists or warnings or whatever genuinely works. Enforce guidelines on roleplay expectation. If I apply for Vort, I want to play like a Vortigaunt. If I apply for Overwatch, I want to play like an Overwatch. It should be the same for all factions regardless.

 

[Cavity]

The problem with CivPro roleplay standards currently is a lot of the playerbase or at least the ones that enter the limelight are playing to get a reaction rather than to act out a character. You could argue it'd be the same for any faction on the server, but currently we're only debating CivPro.

There's not really any guide I can see about how the server wants the general beatcop to act, unlike OTA, Vort etc. It's sort of just a case of, get thrown in and copy those around you, by which are already setting a bad example. If you wanted to fix it, de-whitelist the people intentionally going after OOC reactions and starboard bait and you'd have solved the problem.

My idea of the perfect CivPro would be to have some wits but also knowing that if they aren't doing their job, their family cohesion is on the line. So you know- you'd be an asshole. But regulations and procedures tell you who to be an asshole to based on the situation, ie not being an asshole to every collaborator you see or every civi you see, but entirely scenario based.

The Combine would expect some sort of uniformity in the way their Civil Protection are designed and supposed to act. There's a reason for memory replacement and the cause of it is for a number of reasons. CivPro are technically about as oppressed as the citizen population is, but they receive more benefits. The Combine play a lot on the humanity side of the human psyche, it's not meant to be enjoyable for anyone.

Then you break into the actual Roleplay side of it, which needs to be made enjoyable for each player involved. At a Collaborator level, we try and do different things and open up the range in which is possible to make the role more appealing and enjoyable long term. For Citizen, it's merely a new player/working role where you are in it until you achieve where you want to go, whether it be a union/ministry/rebel/collaborator/civpro etc. This doesn't mean that CivPro should be acting weird or out of character for any reason though, which directly relates back to starboard baiting/playing for a reaction.

If people understood what role they had applied for then they'd probably play it better, but instead we have a case of throwing people in and learning from others who're already doing what we're complaining about. I'd be all for CivPro having a blast behind the curtains within the Nexus, but out on the streets where you're supposed to be an oppressive force, players should be advocating for that gritty style of play rather than the "hey-ho citizen, what're you a fuckin' ugly guy or what haha." There's always room for character development, but there's little to ZERO impact on players who go out of their way to break the atmosphere the faction is supposed to bring.

Basically, punish bad players through de-whitelists or warnings or whatever genuinely works. Enforce guidelines on roleplay expectation. If I apply for Vort, I want to play like a Vortigaunt. If I apply for Overwatch, I want to play like an Overwatch. It should be the same for all factions regardless.

I’m in agreeance with this take. I genuinely tried to make a loyalist character, and instead ended up as a black band because I was constantly targeted, frisked, harassed, and beaten for any minuscule thing. Or simply because a cop was bored.

 

[Cavity]

I’m in agreeable with this take. I genuinely tried to make a loyalist character, and instead ended up as a black band because I was constantly targeted, frisked, harassed, and beaten for any minuscule thing. Or simply because a cop was bored.

The only way to survive in the current setting is by staying far the fuck away from the surface and away from Civil Protection. Just simply because of how predatory they are. Hence why you see 10 civilians on the surface when you have 70 players active on the server.

 

[TheGamingPlumber]

Who cares if they crack jokes and shit talk in their personal time or between each other? That's what any normal person would do to blow off steam, because you have to remember that Civil Protection are humans who have emotions and different personalities too

I don't think they would be saying this...

 

[verTix]

The only way to survive in the current setting is by staying far the fuck away from the surface and away from Civil Protection. Just simply because of how predatory they are. Hence why you see 10 civilians on the surface when you have 70 players active on the server.

no, the reason people don't go to the city is because there's nothing to do in the city and it's extremely easy to escape that situation

it's not oppression that drives people away from the city, it's boredom

willard staff has failed to add any sort of engagement for citizen players

 

[Cavity]

View attachment 47400

I don't think they would be saying this...

Well then, Investigator, you should look into the problem and discipline them.

 

[Rabid]

no, the reason people don't go to the city is because there's nothing to do in the city and it's extremely easy to escape that situation

it's not oppression that drives people away from the city, it's boredom

willard staff has failed to add any sort of engagement for citizen players

This.

When rebels are encouraged to be heavily armed and to sit away from the city, there's no interaction that isn't (literally) hostile. There is a reason one of the best eras for RebelRP was during the Bottlestreet Gang's peak when the city was thriving and most rebels interacted with the city that way, which gave RP to everyone.

 

[RileyTheRoomba]

View attachment 47400

I don't think they would be saying this...

You don't get it people crack jokes at funerals or something.

 

[Acheif]

Rp quality

 

[RileyTheRoomba]

Stop pretending you're playing real cops, or pretending people who criticize your silly shitposting are telling you to be robocops.

Reply-worthy cause this is the only cogent and concise thing said thusfar really and everyone should read, internalize, and ponder over it late into the night. Light a candle of citronella and stare longingly into the starry sky where one day we will all be joined in unity.

Every time this topic comes up be it for CivPro or otherwise it immediately devolves into this convoluted mess of black and white where if you say people shouldn't be cracking minge-esque jokes you apparently advocate for personality-devoid drivel and constant beatings that if anything detract from any semblance of actual coherent 'oppression'. I don't understand why the topic of being a bit more serious is so difficult to broach, and I don't understand why the default response to not being happy with blatant unseriousness is some done-to-death variation of "You don't want characters to have personality", "people make jokes under pressure and I like comic relief", "oppression isn't fun", and a whole host of other weird points only tangentially related to the topic as though all these things exist in a vacuum and by enforcing a standard of roleplay quality you are actively going against them -- which isn't the aim nor actual outcome. Be serious /=/ robocop oppression megabeatdown 3000 24/7 kill all fucking citizens judgement waiver.

If some of the examples shown above and throughout the discord are somehow required for a person's character to have personality, there is something majorly wrong with the way you go about writing characters. And if you consider these interactions the highlight of your day on the server, I believe Serious-RP is perhaps the wrong vocation for you.

Being serious does not mean exclusively beating people, telling people to fuck off, refusing to interact with citizens, etc etc. These people are just as detrimental to the landscape, and if that's your only experience with what you would consider 'serious' RP, then I sympathize with the poor citizen who must turn to wisecrack cops slinging modern internet humour to derive any joy from CityRP. That's not how it should be, but I want to stress the point since it seems so often lost that being serious does not mean roleplaying 100% by what you see in the actual retail game. The behavior in Half-Life Alyx should be almost entirely discounted given how blatantly tongue-and-cheek it is, and the more 'humorous' moments in Half-Life 2 don't even compare to the examples waved about that happen in Willard, so it's silly to point at them to justify entirely unserious behavior. You can be both serious, and display personality. Personality is oftentimes a subtle thing picked up on overtime, and if you have to display it through entirely out of place jokes you are not doing your job as a writer.

I would also like to reject the notion that this is or ever really was a IC issue. It's not. People deliberately playing in a manner of which does not reflect the setting if not outright minging is a OOC issue. It is a conscious choice they are making and not their character, and more just the author's humour (Or lack thereof) bleeding through (Self-insert or cheap stand-in) into dialogue.

I stand with Parsil in the prescribed solution: Bans & Warns.

 

[ford-michigan]

willard staff has failed to add any sort of engagement for citizen players

Soon, I shall do something soon, but I keep getting delayed IC so that soon may be soon™

 

[verTix]

Soon, I shall do something soon, but I keep getting delayed IC so that soon may be soon™

me too but i keep getting delayed OOC by the apathetic admin bureaucracy. took me 2 days to find out whether a map prop was IC or OOC and another 3 hours to get it removed

 

[Rabid]

If some of the examples shown above and throughout the discord are somehow required for a person's character to have personality, there is something majorly wrong with the way you go about writing characters. And if you consider these interactions the highlight of your day on the server, I believe Serious-RP is perhaps the wrong vocation for you.

My problem is that CP leads always overcorrect when it comes to trying to fix this behavior - rather than targetting the individuals, the easy route of taken of simply altering the faction's IC rules to make any sort of public interaction with citizens in a casual manner (or even other cops) punishable, alongside trying to enforce incredibly crippling standards.

This has happened both times this issue has seriously cropped up and been "addressed" since 2020 (and has maybe happened more I haven't personally seen). It never fixes the problem, it just makes people bored and cops go back to AFKing in the street so at least they can't be accused of saying something "unfitting" to a citizen and getting reported.

I'm not saying people don't farm for the starboard or don't do shit that isn't fitting, but I also just don't trust the individual people to be plucked out and warned/banned (which itself is incredibly subjective anyway) as opposed to a blanket bandaid being put on for a third time and people wonder why nothing got fixed.

 

[Lab]

I think one of the main catalysts of this silliness is the announcement of V3. People don't see a reason to take the server seriously anymore because the end is nigh, so they eke as much low-hanging fun as they can.

 

[MazuzaM]

Perhaps the real issue with Civil Protection isn't that they're showing humanity to each other, but rather not showing it to others. If you'd bother to play as a civilian a majority of the time, you'd realize that 90% of the Civil Protection playerbase is made up of brutal assholes who quite literally rob, beat up, torture, and bully people daily.

Can someone tell me how you are ever going to keep a civilian population in support of their government when all that happens is the local Police constantly and unjustifiably rob, kill, torture, beat, harass, and otherwise starve its own population? THAT IS THE UNREALISTIC PART OF HOW CIVIL PROTECTION OPERATES. Because under those circumstances, the civilian population would overthrow the government the next day. Civil Protection needs more players who genuinely assist citizens rather than consistently trying to turn them against the government.

You can argue that "it's a part of the HL2 universe," but that's every day. Every hour. Every week. It becomes unrealistic and ruins the setting because it is unsustainable, turning players away from actually playing as loyalists or citizens in general.

Civil Protection needs a delicate balance between HUMANITY and BRUTALITY.

I don't think you understand what I'm talking about in this post, I am not saying that Metrocops should be more aggressive;

I'm reporting these facts that mark a decline in Roleplay, cops shouldn't be more aggressive than they are, they should be more mature and professional respecting to the indocrination you suffer ICly, showing humanity doesn't mean slinging in starboard bait during 90% of your gameplay because you (random person in the pics) play a """""character"""".

This actively ruins the Dystopian feel of at least using professional language in the field and not be the kind cop literally not doing your job, your job isn't to kill Anti Citizens and keep everything intact, it's to preserve socio-stabilization and order/oversight on the people.

 

[MazuzaM]

If a cop decides to chat with a citizen, who'd realistically give a shit about it? They are citizens pulled off the streets, thrown into a uniform and told "keep the peace however you want because you have the power to.

What are you talking about? The Civil Protection isn't random people put in uniform and told whatever that statement you made is, they pass various evaluations before entering the force in which after you are filled with propaganda, operational procedures and training.

There is a big difference between Metrocop and Citizen in uniform, they're supposed to be surgical and professional to an extent to the public, then in privacy within the Nexus, or during corrupted roleplay (In an alleway for example) you are prone to show your character, but not like how it's being done currently.

 

[MazuzaM]

public interaction with citizens in a casual manner

Casual chatter with random citizens like you believe could easily be restricted to you doing it with Collaborators, matching the feel, in my opinion cops should remain assertive and professional or surgical to an extent with lower grade citizens, not just chit chatting with em.

However most of it is IC issue but imo its not portrayed like it could be portrayed...

 

[Lab]

Another thing to note is the blurred line between OOC and IC and how much these 2 affect each other. If unserious, or for any matter quotes that may be serious but are taken out of context and thus viewed unseriously, are circulated and starboarded, the OOC outlook of the playerbase toward that faction are tarnished.

If players view a faction as unserious, they may feel encouraged to treat the faction unseriously IC'ly. As Riley said, starbait quotes are not 'IC', they are a decision made in OOC and churned through the portal of their respective character, into the server's environment. This behaviour is contagious and starts with its dissemination through para-server forums like the WN Discord.