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Implemented Make learning Japanese (Perhaps all languages) more difficult.

RedHotGinger

RedHotGinger

The Owl
GALUNGA
Joined
Sep 25, 2020
Messages
852
Fairly simple suggestion and I wont start getting technical with it, since I don't really have any specific time in mind.


That being said, I think it would benefit this map extremely if we were to make learning languages via audiobooks a very long, very difficult process that would prevent Sally Supporter and Johnny Rebel from being able to learn Japanese within the first week of this map change.

The reason I suggest this is specifically for this map. Foreign influence in City Eight is being touted as a bit of a plot-point, at least for some time going forward. Many of the new civs are considered 'intruders' and such. This is going to quickly fall flat onto its face if every single newcomer citizen turns out to be polylingual and capable of learning Japanese within a single week of arriving. People are already discussing it as some simple, non hassle process, and once that happens, there's no undoing it.

Keeping this general to prevent locking the suggestion down with a badly formed specific timeframe.
(I also know suggestions are on hold, but if the community agrees, this would hopefully be an exception)
 
What would you suggest, specifically? I know you wanted to just keep it without any specifics but giving a idea could help.

It's possible I could maybe modify gb's skillbook system to make it so you need to read a physical language book to learn a language. The way his system works is it takes x amount of seconds to read the book - so, it could be 5 seconds, or it could be 300 seconds, or even longer. And you can stop reading the book at any point during it and your progress will be saved.
 
What would you suggest, specifically? I know you wanted to just keep it without any specifics but giving a idea could help.
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Avoiding it largely due to my lack of understanding of the absolute current values and how much the community would be willing to extend it as a whole. Far as I am aware, and from what I have been told, you can from the moment you start learn a single language in less than a week. Likely dependent on finances more than anything. I believe there is a cooldown present too, for a day if I recall correctly.

If I were to make a ballpark suggestion, I would say from the moment you start learning a language, it should take some 2-3 weeks to learn. I also think they should be pretty heavily priced to prevent mass purchases and every 'common' fellow being able to jump straight to learning any language up to the hardcap. Though frankly, if the community is fine with it, I'd do even higher. Languages are extremely hard to learn, even at the best of times.
 
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What about stages of fluency? Implementing smth like limiting message length in learned languages for some time after learning the language, or something like that?
 
Make learning a language scale with intelligence skill. Lower = longer. Higher = Shorter.
 
have learning languages be auth based and make audiobooks a significant but not sole factor
 
In my mind, doing a major kick in just the raw time/price it takes to learn them is the most important thing right now. Since people are going to rapidly start consuming audiobooks in order to get around easier in City Eight.

More complicated adjustments should probably be made separately, after this fact.
 
Joku said:
What about stages of fluency? Implementing smth like limiting message length in learned languages for some time after learning the language, or something like that?
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degrees of fluency makes a lot of sense

i've been learning japanese on and off for about a year and i can make out like half of all words
 
Hayden said:
What would you suggest, specifically? I know you wanted to just keep it without any specifics but giving a idea could help.

It's possible I could maybe modify gb's skillbook system to make it so you need to read a physical language book to learn a language. The way his system works is it takes x amount of seconds to read the book - so, it could be 5 seconds, or it could be 300 seconds, or even longer. And you can stop reading the book at any point during it and your progress will be saved.
Click to expand...

I do have a proposal. We've talked previously about fluency levels. Considering that it takes a great amount of time to learn a single language it's nigh-impossible to portary this 1:1 in-game. Instead, we could base the progression around actual script items. I think the 5 audiobooks requirement for learning a languages hould be removed, and have a modifier named fluency.

Fluency, could work in the way, that it's just one giant bar, that needs to be filled up by progress. How is this progress earned?

Through items. Audiobooks and books, which fill up the bar with a certain percentage. I imagine it should be around 2%-5% at most, though this is up for debate.

Also, to add to this: I think players should be able to learn one language at a time. And while we can't fully thin out the characters that speaks over 5+ languages, we certainly can slow down the rate at which they multiply.

Edit: intelligence as an attribute could play into the progression as well.
e.g., books/audiobooks give more progress, cooldown is reduced, et cetera.
 
I want to also propose that we should limit language learning to maximum of 1 or 2 additional languages outside of English, perhaps adding your main Native language as character could be nice addition as not everyone knows how to fluently speak english.

Like if someone wants to learn 2 additional languages or more up to 4 they need auth with proper with, intelligence and actually spend time learning them.
 
Hiros said:
I want to also propose that we should limit language learning to maximum of 1 or 2 additional languages outside of English, perhaps adding your main Native language as character could be nice addition as not everyone knows how to fluently speak english.

Like if someone wants to learn 2 additional languages or more up to 4 they need auth with proper with, intelligence and actually spend time learning them.
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To add to this: the amount of languages you learn, should depend entirely on your intelligence level.

2 points in intelligence = 2 language slots
 
+1

Language barriers should be a point of contention between the native population and transfers from i24. Whilst at a glance it may seem to lower RP opportunity, it is a driving a factor in people actually trying. People RP trying to mime things to make others understand or simplify the way they talk, I've already experienced it myself and it can lead to pretty funny interactions and people failing rolls which in turn just makes both parties try various things to get the message across.

On the other side, it can also be a driver of conflict. Misunderstood words lead to skirmishes due to detail being lost in translation, people naturally being aggravated by foreigners coming in and trying to lay claim to the city where they do not even speak the native tongue. That is a good thing, rising tensions shouldn't be too quick of course but we need driving factors for said rising tensions.
 
I think just.. don’t sell Japanese audiobooks. Simple as.
 
i agree! learning japanese / any language should be like. a weeks long endeavor
 
Learning it rn so i can avoid the verdict of this suggestion :)
 
Fuck you guys, you've been too greedy. Remove all languages in-game; if you want to RP being a polyglot I dare you to learn them in real life.

Earn your right to speak Urdu as a Britishman in-game by flying to Pakistan, settle down at a local village and live there for years
 
Serhan said:
Fuck you guys, you've been too greedy. Remove all languages in-game; if you want to RP being a polyglot I dare you to learn them in real life.

Earn your right to speak Urdu as a Britishman in-game by flying to Pakistan, settle down at a local village and live there for years
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can we just cause a resonance cascade irl?
 
Wanna make ot harder? To learn the language in game you must complete a real life Japanese course.
 
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