Obligatory OTA complaint thread (the sequel)

[Moon]

i say this pretty much as an outsider, but it doesn't look great when the OTA are one of the largest official factions on the server. they can easily rival any of the others in terms of numbers besides the CPs, and their typical function (beside protecting CAs) is usually as a tool to curb and control roleplay rather than make more of it

the hard truth of it (for fans of the ota, i think they're pretty cool myself) is that they're npc characters more than any other. there is pretty much zero room for character development for an ota character since they're usually restricted as to when they can actually flag up, and their personalities - or lack thereof - both make it very difficult to achieve any really meaningful roleplay.

you either change how the OTA function on a fundamental level - e.g. previous attempts to humanise them on hl2rp or give them a bigger presence in certain areas - or you try to offload as much of their duties onto CP characters who are more human and better able to make the shit they have to do more significant, including sweeps.

imo its best to focus on balancing either cps or rebels rather than OTA, but admittedly i dont really know the ins and outs of the server. still, the arguments ring vaguely reminiscent because people have been debating this stuff for years

 

[Hiros]

i say this pretty much as an outsider, but it doesn't look great when the OTA are one of the largest official factions on the server. they can easily rival any of the others in terms of numbers besides the CPs, and their typical function (beside protecting CAs) is usually as a tool to curb and control roleplay rather than make more of it

the hard truth of it (for fans of the ota, i think they're pretty cool myself) is that they're npc characters more than any other. there is pretty much zero room for character development for an ota character since they're usually restricted as to when they can actually flag up, and their personalities - or lack thereof - both make it very difficult to achieve any really meaningful roleplay.

you either change how the OTA function on a fundamental level - e.g. previous attempts to humanise them on hl2rp or give them a bigger presence in certain areas - or you try to offload as much of their duties onto CP characters who are more human and better able to make the shit they have to do more significant, including sweeps.

imo its best to focus on balancing either cps or rebels rather than OTA, but admittedly i dont really know the ins and outs of the server. still, the arguments ring vaguely reminiscent because people have been debating this stuff for years

OTA do have emotions just suppressed. HL:A level. It's due to some "faulty generation" they are restricted from flagging yes because people complain when they see 3 ota online.

OTA is very much able to provide RP you just might not see them since there is behavior behind closed doors and behavior in the public.

 

[NaughtyNicholas]

OTA do have emotions just suppressed. HL:A level. It's due to some "faulty generation" they are restricted from flagging yes because people complain when they see 3 ota online.

OTA is very much able to provide RP you just might not see them since there is behavior behind closed doors and behavior in the public.

So basically what you are saying is that OTA circlejerk behind closed doors with their “suppressed” emotions or whatever the hell you mean. Then act like NPCs in public. I don’t take the OTA NPC thing out of my ass considering whenever they “guard” something or escort someone outside the nexus it consists of shooting the guard next to anyone who gets close and spitting out some VC.

 

[Moon]

OTA do have emotions just suppressed. HL:A level. It's due to some "faulty generation" they are restricted from flagging yes because people complain when they see 3 ota online.

OTA is very much able to provide RP you just might not see them since there is behavior behind closed doors and behavior in the public.

if they're not robots then fair enough, but then i have to ask the question: what exactly is the difference between an overwatch grunt and a metrocop with an smg? what warrants their inclusion so dearly when one is a effectively a paramilitary member with a submachine gun and the other is just a soldier with a submachine gun? what can an overwatch soldier really do that a civil protection member couldnt?

civil protection are pretty much superior at everything solely because they're very human characters and thus able to benefit from character development that ota typically cannot. one of the only arguments is that you can't gear metrocops up with ar2s and tons of grenades, but if these are really necessary just to keep steady footing with rebels then it probably says more about the state of rebels on the server than anything else

 

[HOKI]

One time OTA shot at citizens in the plaza because event city admins were going to the Nexus (no one was even interfering). it was quite humorous

 

[Rabid]

civil protection are pretty much superior at everything solely because they're very human characters and thus able to benefit from character development that ota typically cannot. one of the only arguments is that you can't gear metrocops up with ar2s and tons of grenades, but if these are really necessary just to keep steady footing with rebels then it probably says more about the state of rebels on the server than anything else

Offloading OTA duties onto CP's sounds great until you realise a very big chunk of this server's rebel playerbase defaults to ripping into them for "destroying roleplay/developed characters/breaking fear rp/being non-characters/being a shit faction" the moment they're upset over a sweep, search, arrest, etc.

I'm not even trying to be snide but if they're sweeping then you aren't going to get deep and complex roleplay with them regardless even if it was all done by cops; the chances of the average unit being captured and allowed to go rogue vs either being murdered in a sweep or getting shit for shooting rebels is basically nil.

The faction doesn't need the extra weight (read: shit) of also being a tool to restore the balance of things that OTA currently have.

 

[verTix]

So basically what you are saying is that OTA circlejerk behind closed doors with their “suppressed” emotions or whatever the hell you mean. Then act like NPCs in public. I don’t take the OTA NPC thing out of my ass considering whenever they “guard” something or escort someone outside the nexus it consists of shooting the guard next to anyone who gets close and spitting out some VC.

First of all, yes. I think OTA should be doing more things in the city that don’t involve killing rebels.

Second of all, the NPC behavior is realistic to the bodyguard job. You could put a normal guy on guard duty and he would act the same way. Watch secret service agents as they walk around with the president. They don’t talk to people. They push people away when they get too close. Not an OTA problem. It’s a guard problem.

 

[The Milkman]

Offloading OTA duties onto CP's sounds great until you realise a very big chunk of this server's rebel playerbase defaults to ripping into them for "destroying roleplay/developed characters/breaking fear rp/being non-characters/being a shit faction" the moment they're upset over a sweep, search, arrest, etc.

I'm not even trying to be snide but if they're sweeping then you aren't going to get deep and complex roleplay with them regardless even if it was all done by cops; the chances of the average unit being captured and allowed to go rogue vs either being murdered in a sweep or getting shit for shooting rebels is basically nil.

The faction doesn't need the extra weight (read: shit) of also being a tool to restore the balance of things that OTA currently have.

I see your point, but I don't get how it's any different/better with OTA if not worse in terms of your first 2 paragraphs

Take for example one sweep that happened:

Rebel gets caught by a random sweep, she calls for help.

Me, another vort, a human, and Grunk of course go to fight the sweep despite a huge advantage for CPs

CPs have shot the rebel up and are taking her captive right there in the sewers. We show up and start blasting so we can get away.

I eventually down a cop, defender-8, and then grabbed him and took him hostage.

I made a deal: give the rebel back or the cop dies. One of the cop foolishly yell back "your friend is dead!" despite the rebel we were trying to save being very much alive. So of course I promptly blast poor Defender-8 in the face and kill him.

Eventually, we retreat and the CPs are so spooked that they ended up just ripcording without even taking the rebel with them (something about her claiming to have a suicide vest too, as well as personal vendetta shit between her and one of the RLs).

So what would have happened with OTA? My guess it the rebel would have gotten killed long before we showed up, and then they would have just shot at us without a word or any RP.

Cops are better. Keep OTA for super serious stuff and/or outland duties. And I mean SUPER serious.

 

[Rabid]

Second of all, the NPC behavior is realistic to the bodyguard job. You could put a normal guy on guard duty and he would act the same way. Watch secret service agents as they walk around with the president. They don’t talk to people. They push people away when they get too close. Not an OTA problem. It’s a guard problem.

Not to mention whatever way you spin it, the argument is flawed af. "OTA don't do roleplay because I don't see it" - okay, so how do you justify 90% of RebelRP sitting roleplaying where people don't see it then?

I wouldn't because its a fucking dumb argument. Besides, do you really wanna see OTA sitting around doing passive with citizens? I personally think the same people would be complaining about how cringe it is lol

People don't play OTA for character development, they play it to fill the role of an intimidating enemy super soldier. Its cool to be able to shadow CAB and look intimidating and carry cool guns and do some basic cool soldier rp with one another. Not everything needs to be totally about character development.

Hell, fucking Grunk exists and I can't imagine that thing gets played in all reality for any DEEP CHARACTER DEV. People tried to stick fucking guns on it at one point lmao. Why? Because its a cool friendly bullsquid. That's fine, it is cool. I like it.

I see your point, but I don't get how it's any different/better with OTA if not worse in terms of your first 2 paragraphs

Because the same people (rebel players) who wax poetic about how they're totally supporting cop development are usually the ones who'll turn around and dismiss it the moment they're angry.

Having the OTA faction keeps the "harsher" aspects of that AWAY from the cop faction. OTA respond to the serious shit where a lot of rebels might die, but people know full well what OTA are there for.

With cops you'd get 3849394 complaints about them "breaking character/fearrp" and shit to have to steamroll the sewers like OTA do.

 

[The Milkman]

Not to mention whatever way you spin it, the argument is flawed af. "OTA don't do roleplay because I don't see it" - okay, so how do you justify 90% of RebelRP sitting roleplaying where people don't see it then?

I wouldn't because its a fucking dumb argument. Besides, do you really wanna see OTA sitting around doing passive with citizens? I personally think the same people would be complaining about how cringe it is lol

People don't play OTA for character development, they play it to fill the role of an intimidating enemy super soldier. Its cool to be able to shadow CAB and look intimidating and carry cool guns and do some basic cool soldier rp with one another. Not everything needs to be totally about character development.

Hell, fucking Grunk exists and I can't imagine that thing gets played in all reality for any DEEP CHARACTER DEV. People tried to stick fucking guns on it at one point lmao. Why? Because its a cool friendly bullsquid. That's fine, it is cool. I like it.



Because the same people (rebel players) who wax poetic about how they're totally supporting cop development are usually the ones who'll turn around and dismiss it the moment they're angry.

Having the OTA faction keeps the "harsher" aspects of that AWAY from the cop faction. OTA respond to the serious shit where a lot of rebels might die, but people know full well what OTA are there for.

With cops you'd get 3849394 complaints about them "breaking character/fearrp" and shit to have to steamroll the sewers.

'less complaining' isn't really something I consider worth it when there are so many better stories to tell with CPs than OTA. Sure, sometimes OTA are necessary to keep things balanced, but I disagree that because rebels do 1 big thing like, a month, that OTA need to respond en masse as if a group managing to take some cops by surprised means they gotta go terminator mode.

I will die on this hill, cops are better. Only send in OTA if cops for real cannot handle the rebels, or if the rebels are staging a genuine uprising or some shit.

And don't compare grunk to ota.... u insult him...............

 

[Raptorian]

Hell, fucking Grunk exists and I can't imagine that thing gets played in all reality for any DEEP CHARACTER DEV. People tried to stick fucking guns on it at one point lmao. Why? Because its a cool friendly bullsquid. That's fine, it is cool. I like it.

grunk has more char dev than all of the OTA combined

 

[Kappatalist]

First of all, yes. I think OTA should be doing more things in the city that don’t involve killing rebels.

Second of all, the NPC behavior is realistic to the bodyguard job. You could put a normal guy on guard duty and he would act the same way. Watch secret service agents as they walk around with the president. They don’t talk to people. They push people away when they get too close. Not an OTA problem. It’s a guard problem.

What can they possibly be doing in the city? Watching an eight man team escort Heartwick to the fucking barber shop is hilariously ridiculous, especially when their first port of call is to start blasting into the ground like it's impulse because you got a little close.

Their only purpose imo should be to act as a balancing force, they aren't anything but event characters and people are right in saying cops should be the ones doing these things.

 

[NaughtyNicholas]

inb4 one of the SA decides to close the thread

 

[Stinky Rags]

The grunts in half life alyx do express emotions but they're grunts; transhuman but not quite there yet, none of the overwatch back then are quite done yet, but they are the least brain messed up. the grunts also beg for their life when headcrabs nut their skull, are we then to expect that Willard OTA will plead for their lives if ambushed?

ota should have no personality and emotion save for ones that come from biological impulses, like extreme shock. anything else just defeats the purpose of them to me.

 

[AppleFlavoredFox]

This is what bothers me. Mercy for the sake of RP is shown from one side, which would no doubt have led to something interesting one way or another. I know Combine bad and all that, but cops, at least, may have a slight inkling to either spare someone in the future for this, or let it affect them in other ways.

OTA, on the other hand.... well I've always mentioned that the entire faction is kinda skewed considering they're solely a PK force that has absolutely nothing to lose but their pride if they die.

Exactly and i love interacting with the CP's even if we're shootin at eachother. Its a great time, and usually if our side wins, we mend the wounded and take prisoners. Allowing them to actually resume their lives.

 

[AppleFlavoredFox]

I see your point, but I don't get how it's any different/better with OTA if not worse in terms of your first 2 paragraphs

Take for example one sweep that happened:

Rebel gets caught by a random sweep, she calls for help.

Me, another vort, a human, and Grunk of course go to fight the sweep despite a huge advantage for CPs

CPs have shot the rebel up and are taking her captive right there in the sewers. We show up and start blasting so we can get away.

I eventually down a cop, defender-8, and then grabbed him and took him hostage.

I made a deal: give the rebel back or the cop dies. One of the cop foolishly yell back "your friend is dead!" despite the rebel we were trying to save being very much alive. So of course I promptly blast poor Defender-8 in the face and kill him.

Eventually, we retreat and the CPs are so spooked that they ended up just ripcording without even taking the rebel with them (something about her claiming to have a suicide vest too, as well as personal vendetta shit between her and one of the RLs).

So what would have happened with OTA? My guess it the rebel would have gotten killed long before we showed up, and then they would have just shot at us without a word or any RP.

Cops are better. Keep OTA for super serious stuff and/or outland duties. And I mean SUPER serious.

That was Angel. My character. I was bluffing with them about the vest and they indeed bought it. It was amazing. They didn't tie me up when they downed me. And i threatened to suicide bomb them when they tried capturing me. And they bolted. Was great.

 

[The Milkman]

One other issue is rebelRP itself.

Rebels are becoming more powerful with each expo that hands high-tier weapons, which is good, right?

But so far, well-off groups are too powerful for cops to handle 70% of the time if the CPs don't outrageously outnumber the rebels, but not powerful enough to fight a fully kitted out squad of OTA (MP7 OTA squad maybe)

So once every rebel group has a steady supply of non-craftable guns and CPs are constantly getting overrun, then we'll get constant Overwatch sweeps that have no chance of being fought back. Rebels being powerful ironically only fucks themselves.

Balancing should be centered around rebels Vs. CPs, not rebels versus OTA... because OTA are just an OOC tool to keep the scales tipped in combine favor so there isn't an uprising every 5 days.

And dont even get me started about free vorts

 

[verTix]

What can they possibly be doing in the city? Watching an eight man team escort Heartwick to the fucking barber shop is hilariously ridiculous, especially when their first port of call is to start blasting into the ground like it's impulse because you got a little close.

There should be more elements of Xen infestation in and around the slums. OTA would work alongside CPs and CIC to clean up goop, and rebels would be motivated to keep the Xen flora around because of its benefits to vorts and stuff.

Also, I think the "guns-up, warning shot, no-speak" form of escorting is extremely tired but in terms of protection it's pretty much the best way to do things unless you want punch spam. But private bodyguards don't talk to people even in real life.

Their only purpose imo should be to act as a balancing force, they aren't anything but event characters and people are right in saying cops should be the ones doing these things.

OTA has so much potential beyond just being a balancer. The collective of HL2RPers has been brainwashed into thinking that OTA are completely incapable of anything more than robotic rebel killers.

They are shown evidence of OTA's RP potential in the form of a main-series Half-Life game, and they turn the other cheek.

I do not blame anyone in particular; all of your minds have been corrupted by Big Rebel.

I am enlightened. The ideas I preach may never come to fruition, but I will never cease to continue to preach them...

 

[Rabid]

And don't compare grunk to ota.... u insult him...............

grunk has more char dev than all of the OTA combined

I'm not trying to shit on Grunk (I actually really like him and think he's very well RP'd), ya'll both kinda missed my point a little.

Grunk is ultimately emotionally stunted (because he's an alien animal), and I certainly haven't had a chance to RP with him on my character. 95% of the server outside of the Resistance & Vorts haven't and won't, either. Does that then mean Grunk is pointless, adds nothing and that he doesn't roleplay just because I haven't directly seen it?

The same exact argument is thrown against OTA repeatedly as a "got'cha!".

But I wouldn't levy it against Grunk because that's nonsensical and stupid so I'm not going to levy it against people trying to fight the stigma that OTA don't do roleplay. Just because you don't see it doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

What can they possibly be doing in the city? Watching an eight man team escort Heartwick to the fucking barber shop is hilariously ridiculous, especially when their first port of call is to start blasting into the ground like it's impulse because you got a little close.

Their only purpose imo should be to act as a balancing force, they aren't anything but event characters and people are right in saying cops should be the ones doing these things.

If the choice is a warning-shot at people getting too close or trapping your entire squad + HVT in the miasma of TBC and possibly let people run up in ambush, 9/10 times I'm choosing to warning-shot too. Lingering around with someone as important as Heartwick in the streets isn't ideal.

Plus most cops wouldn't be happy to pull escort duty - its boring and stops them doing shit like watching for crimes or whatever else. The problem isn't that cops couldn't do it, its that cops wouldn't want to.

That and 2 OTA > 2 Cops in regards to protection. Rebels are way more likely to try and murder a CA character when cops are defending them than OTA.

One other issue is rebelRP itself.

Rebels are becoming more powerful with each expo that hands high-tier weapons, which is good, right?

But so far, well-off groups are too powerful for cops to handle 70% of the time if the CPs don't outrageously outnumber the rebels, but not powerful enough to fight a fully kitted out squad of OTA (MP7 OTA squad maybe)

So once every rebel group has a steady supply of non-craftable guns and CPs are constantly getting overrun, then we'll get constant Overwatch sweeps that have no chance of being fought back. Rebels being powerful ironically only fucks themselves.

Balancing should be centered around rebels Vs. CPs, not rebels versus OTA... because OTA are just an OOC tool to keep the scales tipped in combine favor so there isn't an uprising every 5 days.

And dont even get me started about free vorts

This entire post is also a huge factor and shouldn't be slept on.

Cops can't use their full weight because they'd win, but rebel progression is measured in weaponry that makes dunking on cops easier - which means more and more escalation into OTA.

 

[Kappatalist]

There should be more elements of Xen infestation in and around the slums. OTA would work alongside CPs and CIC to clean up goop, and rebels would be motivated to keep the Xen flora around because of its benefits to vorts and stuff.

Also, I think the "guns-up, warning shot, no-speak" form of escorting is extremely tired but in terms of protection it's pretty much the best way to do things unless you want punch spam. But private bodyguards don't talk to people even in real life.



OTA has so much potential beyond just being a balancer. The collective of HL2RPers has been brainwashed into thinking that OTA are completely incapable of anything more than robotic rebel killers.

They are shown evidence of OTA's RP potential in the form of a main-series Half-Life game, and they turn the other cheek.

I do not blame anyone in particular; all of your minds have been corrupted by Big Rebel.

I am enlightened. The ideas I preach may never come to fruition, but I will never cease to continue to preach them...

Rebels aren't gonna keep an infestation around so a bunch of supersoldiers they can't fight can come try to clear it in their back yard.

Most of these things can easily be the domain of CP. OTA are there to keep balance as a powerful foe, they shouldn't be seen as often as they are let alone more. There's no actual reason here other than "being OTA is cool and shit"