Rebels should not have events or expeditions if they do not create engaging content themselves.

[Conundrum]

Now this suggestion is going to be controversial and rile up a good portion of the community, probably, but I propose that no further creative events are provided specifically to the Rebel playerbase by default.

A new system is suggested to come into effect, one where disruptive acts against the Combine on the main server provide points which can be redeemed by the Rebel faction lead(s) to decide what kind of story content they can be spent on. Both random acts of terrorism, as well as quest goals should provide these points. Which can be spent on shipments, narratives and expeditions. With the latter costing a good amount.

Perhaps this could encourage Rebels to put their characters at risk to create 'greater' change, or at least provide something for the general population to gossip about. If they do not do so, then they are provided no support.

The CCA is essentially being given the full narrative focus because unlike Rebels, who should be a counter balance, the CCA actually has a presence and is already in a position to do what they want largely unchallenged.

I don't know. It is just a suggestion. Something needs to change and I'm sure someone else can think up the nuances. I have yet to feel any impact Rebels have provided to the main server. At most, some throwaways have made things mildly interesting with their kamikazi's spicing things up. Dedicated Rebels may as well not exist.

 

[Fallizs]

LOL.
I'll send a few screenshots to show how wrong this is.

This is an auth for me removing 1 level that I missclicked (Took almost 4 days)
View attachment 20976

View attachment 20977

Took 4 DAYS just to do something as simple as that.

Now another example:
View attachment 20978
View attachment 20979
Another one...
View attachment 20980
View attachment 20981
With all the examples shown above, we can assume that the average time they take to respond is 4-10 days, which CLEARLY doesn't work for something as Gr4ss described.

Auths only work for assaulting buildings(As they don't move with time), or such things. Not for people, as shown by the time it takes to make auths.
If we understand this point, we can then assume that it's 100% impossible to do rebel activity as he describes and be invisible on the surface while still making a difference, as either you're actively involved in the slums to know what's up (Since they don't post shit in the discord anymore), or you're a city rebel and can't do shit other than rob buildings or get information (Which is used for absolutely nothing unless an event/transfer is going on, which simply does not happen.)

​

 

[Neonity]

Used to work that way.

Nobody has ever lost their Civil Protection WL for going rogue.

Only thing that comes close is temporarily "losing" it in the sense that you wouldn't be allowed to create a new CP while your rogue one is alive because of the rule disallowing two characters in the whitelist.

 

[Belgg]

View attachment 20982​

Ye ngl the fact that you keep saying you had no advantages over others is 50% true, and you should know yourself (@Gr4Ss)
Just for the fact that you're a staff member, GMs will have no problem giving you fucking 10 Ar2's, cus they know, or assume that you won't abuse them and instead will give them a good use. And you know this yourself. You aren't dumb

There will always be an advantage for you, wether you want it or not, since subconsciously, the creative team and other staff will be more careful when dealing with your character, making her deal with less trouble and obtaining greater rewards, as again, they trust you and know you won't mess up, and also won't give you much trouble since they may fear having any trouble with you for killing your character by spawning too many shit, or something similar.

 

[George]

assaulting buildings(As they don't move with time)

Buildings don't move? Think again bud.​

 

[dude]

View attachment 20983
Buildings don't move? Think again bud.​

damn... now we cant attack any buildings either?!

 

[Pasta]

Pasta Posting two days in a row this odd to me.

I'm going to start off by saying while many points have been made in this thread the overall core of the thread is "Rebels shouldn't have events." which is something I heavily disagree with. This is coming from someone who honest to god and only plays Combine-aligned characters, it's just the type of RP I enjoy far more than the rebel side of things. There's no reason to stunt the Rebel players for going out into events to take on other combine forces, for example, to hit some kind of communication tower, it doesn't directly impact the main server right away, but it can bleed into making a story for the Civil Protection as to why their commo is down. Thus this can allow Rebels to do a few more things in the city while they're scrambling.

I think the thought process of "Me vs You." Is kinda silly when it comes to a Roleplay server as well, more so on the gmod medium. It can be done and it is done quite often. In an OOC light of things, it is up to the community to work together to improve not only the quality of roleplay but how the story works as a whole. Having this notion that events for Rebels don't add anything is a little silly. Perhaps some events could be adjusted for rebels to make it a better narrative on the outside of the city.

Doing stuff in the city is supposed to be far harder, I think those who only focus on Rebel RP in the city are seriously missing out on doing outlands stuff. Trying to go forward with other objectives, try to hit other things that aren't part of the main city but can affect the story overall. When it comes to IN CITY roleplay, however, I would honestly like to encourage more things. I enjoy doing investigations, I enjoy interacting with rebels, what I don't enjoy is the constant shot cop because it bleeds into the already struggling Citizen RP. Having to harm that medium is annoying and gets old after a few times - is constant. There was a time for around two weeks we didn't get to Blue Status. Even now we're not. Everything is tense on high alert which is GREAT.

I'm biased and I think I will attempt to get some events for the Civil Protection in the future as well. It's not impossible just uncommon. I want to also encourage Rebels to keep pushing for events as well, let's just not keep bombing the same things or attempting to shoot up a cop. There's more than that in RP.

I'm slightly rambling.

Tldr; Rebels should have events, but players need to think outside the box a little more. We as a community should also encourage different avenues of RP. Not everything HAS to happen in an event. Not everything impactful thing has to be in the city.

 

[Gr4Ss]

Your character is an event character. And you are an administrator :|

For the record, that wasn't on an event character and it never was. It simply took part in the original short stories but I never really had any benefit from that. I just spent a lot of time gathering scrap and scrounging up stuff. Same as every other street rat. And it took me twice as long due to not abusing the shit out of smuggling. I had the numbers, I knew exactly which things to make if I wanted to.

Also, yes, attacks with auths are hard to pull off. I may have had the advantage that the auth team knew me and might have handled things quicker/trusted me to be fair with the thing. I cannot take my own good standing with other admins away. But nothing stops players from having such good standing with admins either (the problem more is that being in good standing often makes one become admin, so the advantage of one often comes with the other). On the other hand, most of my attacks were planned. CPRD lab was stationary, I just needed a GM at peak time when OTA weren't fucking about too much. The funeral was announced the day before or so, which gave me time to scout the angle of attack while getting the auth (simple merge of incendiary and explosive compound, both being items I had available) and find someone to help me out with the escape. Last attack again was a stationary target.

Again, as I stated, I believe patience is key. Acting on short notice often is hard, even as a lone wolf who doesn't need to coordinate people. But you do also need to see opportunities and come up with creative approaches to enable attacks. But if you hit one every one-two months you are already on a good roll.

Also, kind of up to the auth team, but if you need an auth on short notice for important stuff, put it in the title and make it clear to them to get on it. Perhaps the lesson to learn here is they should allow you to notify/ask them in such cases. Or someone higher up in the team needs to rip them a new behind if they don't handle an urgent auth within the time-frame required. That might be a key thing in this whole discussion (other than rebels needing to be able to do shit outside the City on something like expeditions, to lessen the need for rebellion within the City).

I highly dislike auths myself as it puts up these arbitrary barriers to acting on short notice. Sometimes you NEED to act on short notice, and our current auth process simply doesn't cater to it. It isn't really a process of 'is this realistically possible' but 'do we trust this guy and want to allow him to do this'. It is a two-edged blade. It also acts as a sort of barrier of entry so people don't try to (metaphorically) pull a makeshift spike bomb out of their undies every time a CCA member pokes their head outside. The unfortunately reality is that some people would take the liberty too far to the point where it isn't healthy for the server anymore. And this being GMod, give people a hand and they will take the whole arm and proceed to bludgeon the ship they are on to the bottom of the ocean (aka they will ruin the server for short-term brownie points, leaving them with no server to play on for long-term brownie points).

 

[swagile]

I know there are no expeditions for rebels (I never got to have mine because they were CANCELLED right as it was my turn to go). Consider my post an argument to give rebels expeditions again now that they are starting up once more. And to keep going at it. And to make them matter. I am not sure why you think we disagree here on like the first three points...

Also I don't need to look far for rebels that actually pulled off what I mentioned, because I did it myself - thrice. First time was on i17 where I had essentially started with bare basics (like 300 chips bare basics) and ended up EMP'ing the CPRD lab. Yes, I went through auths for this, made the EMP device using explosives and planted it myself. The entire resistance the whole time on i17 had basically managed to achieve fuck all up to that point. I sat on a bench on the plaza for the sweep timer.

Once was actually fire bombing a funeral that the vice admin was attending together with like every single loyalist online, and I got recruited (read: forced) into the workshift to put out my own fire as I was sitting out my sweep timer on a bench in the plaza. I didn't have explosives at that time, but I was only building up for 2 months and mainly gathering things for my expo which didn't include explosives (with 3 weeks of shit gained left in i17). I had 2 pulse weapons, bunch of armor and some other expo shit without abusing chip loops on the smuggler... I believe that to be worth more than the few explosives a certain rebel used to blow up half the RDT around that time too... Again, this was with auth to use some explosives to cover a larger area with thermite to get a big fire going more quickly.

The other time was firebombing the emergency RDT setup in a store bordering the slums, but CWU put out that fire quickly so it didn't amount to much. Too soon after my first fire I guess. I did wait out my sweep timer on a bench in the plaza again though.

So far Alice still hasn't gotten a BOLO or anything more on her than me purposely giving lip to cops who don't know the contraband guide I wrote and steal my disinfected bandages. Can't be a model citizen if you are going to be seen hanging around the slums as well. Alice did actually go out on an expo, I just didn't really gain anything from it because everyone is a fucking scriptwhore and made me pay an antlion extract to not get killed.

So yeah, say again it can't be done... If I didn't have an actual life to keep me busy, I would come back to do it a fourth time to prove the point.

Edit: would also like to mention, I purposely handicapped myself by disallowing myself chip loops. I also purposely avoided doing anything where me being an admin would have given me an advantage. I got my shit either through means available to normal players, or by going through a GM like a normal player would. Nothing was self-authed.

yeah this is 100% possible, my neighborhood watch leader got all my scripts via the normal player route, and none of the gear i and all my companions used in the triumph incident was admin spawned

its possible to both be a passive saboteur, and a active guerilla; it just takes so much time now that i wouldn't come back to willard as a rebel since i have a job aka real life now; you kinda have to treat rebel like a real life job on willard to do anything of substance and fuck doing that again lol!

 

[Belgg]

Also, kind of up to the auth team, but if you need an auth on short notice for important stuff, put it in the title and make it clear to them to get on it. Perhaps the lesson to learn here is they should allow you to notify/ask them in such cases. Or someone higher up in the team needs to rip them a new behind if they don't handle an urgent auth within the time-frame required. That might be a key thing in this whole discussion (other than rebels needing to be able to do shit outside the City on something like expeditions, to lessen the need for rebellion within the City).

Agreed. For the rest, I also agree.

 

[Belgg]

its possible to both be a passive saboteur, and a active guerilla; it just takes so much time now that i wouldn't come back to willard as a rebel since i have a job aka real life now; you kinda have to treat rebel like a real life job on willard to do anything of substance and fuck doing that again lol!

This too

If grinding would take less time and actually be REWARDS THAT YOU GET FROM RP, instead of REWARDS THAT YOU GET FROM FUCKING MINGING AND BEING AROUND AT 1AM AND ASKING AROUND:" YOU HAVE TOOLKIT? ME WANT BUILD. ME BUILDER MAN BUILD BIG GUN AND KILL COMBINE, YES? GIVE ME ADHESIVE, YES?" which is willard's rp rn (Or was when I left)

I'd honestly not care OOCly when any of my characters die if the scripts weren't such a fucking pain in the ass to get, as it's no longer just making a story arch, it's fucking getting the scripts to (help) continue the story, and a big part of that is grinding like a bitch, which people with life can't do.
Willard's mechanics just exist to enslave people in Willard. Literally. If only there were more events or rp ways to get scripts without having to be online 24/7... And this has been commented on many times before, and still they don't seem to change it.

 

[𝔄𝔪𝔟𝔢𝔯𝔮]

all the cards fell over

This wouldn't be the first time when the strong Male05 disappears/dies everything implodes

 

[SpookyWolf07]

Now this suggestion is going to be controversial and rile up a good portion of the community, probably, but I propose that no further creative events are provided specifically to the Rebel playerbase by default.

A new system is suggested to come into effect, one where disruptive acts against the Combine on the main server provide points which can be redeemed by the Rebel faction lead(s) to decide what kind of story content they can be spent on. Both random acts of terrorism, as well as quest goals should provide these points. Which can be spent on shipments, narratives and expeditions. With the latter costing a good amount.

Perhaps this could encourage Rebels to put their characters at risk to create 'greater' change, or at least provide something for the general population to gossip about. If they do not do so, then they are provided no support.

The CCA is essentially being given the full narrative focus because unlike Rebels, who should be a counter balance, the CCA actually has a presence and is already in a position to do what they want largely unchallenged.

I don't know. It is just a suggestion. Something needs to change and I'm sure someone else can think up the nuances. I have yet to feel any impact Rebels have provided to the main server. At most, some throwaways have made things mildly interesting with their kamikazi's spicing things up. Dedicated Rebels may as well not exist.

While I totally agree with the sentiment that the Rebel Faction isn't doing a whole lot. TerrorismRP is so boring and its already being done so there's kind of no point to it.

I also think that Expeditions should be more focused on quests that actually affect Main Server rather than grant Rebels scripts. Perhaps they attack or sabotage the power to the city. You can't blame slummers for something jackasses did 30 miles away from the City have done.

But I also think that the real way to make Rebels more fearsome is to avoid all Traditional Insurgency RP and focus on the "Rogue" grindset. I won't get into too much depth since I've already written a guide about it, but it will definitely improve both Rebel and Loyalist (thereby CitizenRP) if the playerbase was all together... Paranoid and unsure of whose loyal and whose anti-civil.

And no I didn't read the last 4 pages because I'm lazy.

 

[Rabid]

I hate to say this but the idea that "ah yeah if scripts were more common we'd not care about death" is a fantasy. Maybe you personally wouldn't care but the majority of people would - even if they say otherwise.

I've been in the Gmod scene since 2009 and I have never ever ever ever ever seen a server that wasn't an event (and even then its not remotely a guarantee) where the abundance of scripts suddenly made people willing to lose characters. That isn't how people work. You put time and effort into anything to any major degree and have the chance to keep it?

You'll probably want to keep it.

This wouldn't be the first time when the strong Male05 disappears/dies everything implodes

The problem with any sort of Gmod RP (RebelRP as a whole suffers most from it tbh) is 99% of people want to spend their time RPing, not directing RP. So invariably the few people smart enough to wrangle others get burned out and nobody else carries anything on.

And so the cycle repeats.

 

[𝔄𝔪𝔟𝔢𝔯𝔮]

The problem with any sort of Gmod RP...

Straight facts.