Navigation section

Welcome!

By registering with us, you'll be able to discuss, share and private message with other members of our community.

SignUp Now!

Shoot 2 Kill: The worst combat system for HL2RP.

Status
Not open for further replies.
Hey guys listen, this is yet a new community and so still a new server to come. So why can't we just try out the new scripts and stuff that's available to us instead of the old additions we have? I understand s2k is well known and may work well, but so may this system aswell if it's well designed and well anticipated.

Again, a new server, new opportunities and we should take those opportunities to make our server more unique over the others, you feel me?
 
Last edited:
Yes, I agree. Just let everything play out so the new system can be tried.

Also... isn't our turn-based system just S2Rp with automation? I mean, if you think about it, S2RP is literally turn-based done manually. Players take turns, actions have a random success chance dependant on rolls or whatever players involved decide on whatever may appear to be logical to them in the situation, etc and it allows for the roleplay, giving players their /me's and everything. So when you look at S2RP that way... our turn-based system is the exact same with a few additions + automation removing the need of potential admin help and removing that OOC aspect when it comes to asking whose turn it is.

Not to mention, cheaters/hackers are stopped dead in their tracks as their aimbots will fail them in fights 100% of the time, considering they have a limited amount of shots they can take and even if their shots connect, they can still register as missed depending on what the automated system decides + damage is more realistic in the system I do believe.

But anyway, regardless of your opinions on the matter, it is best to just try the system out before criticising it. Once you try it, you might realize that you love it or even notice it does sort of resemble S2RP.

As for S2K... that is forever out of the question. It can go into the bin and be gone forever.
 
If a Event Server Event/Major Event has a reason to turn off the TBCS then they can (rather easily) do so via the config file. The combat system will still be the default outside of events and I doubt that will change unless its somehow a complete disaster.

Of course, as most in this thread have already stated at this point- please try out the system before criticizing it. At this point the system is not fully complete and entirely implemented so the alpha video as has been shown so far does not represent a completed system. More will likely be shown regarding this system before server release when it accounts for everything that we intended it to do so.
 
Last edited:
Robert said:
  • People who are stat grinding have an advantage (Though this is being fixed by Equinox, so we will wait and see how that goes)
    • This basically just means attribute whoring
Click to expand...
I am not the one fixing this. As I understand it's up to Luna or AleXXX. I just like to make suggestions on it.
 
Trailing kinda off what Robert said, if turn-based combat is modified to do so, it should easily be able to be S2RP, with the benefit of running the "fairness" side of things. The number 1 issue with S2RP I've seen is that players often have vastly different ideas as to what their character is capable of and what is realistic. This leads into massive hissy fits of shit flinging. I've seen it countless times.

Turn-Based combat easily negates this. It goes off your character's inherent stats, so unless you purposefully handicap yourself and then complain about it, you can't say that "my character is able to block that!" because according to the attributes you gave them, they wouldn't be able too. It simplifies RP down to "Character attempts to bring the weapon down upon his head." and then actually caclulates if your character can do that instead of just going off player logic which can easily devolve into shitfest. It's effectively a tabletop system, which is what we want, considering that tabletop combat is proven to work in Roleplay settings after decades of use.

So with a few modifications, you could easily run what is effectively S2RP but through a tabletop/turn-based system. If anything, this should be what HL2RP is aiming for, a smooth system of combat that incorporates roleplay. The only reason this hasn't come up earlier is beyond me, though I think it was just a lack of skill or initiative on developers in the past.
 
Haha, alright guys. Take it easy now...

Everybody just *chill*.

I don't know if the vast majority of people advocating for S2... stat system turn based are gonna love it all too much. Knowing where I've met all these players at, except TheDeNuke he sucks, I feel like it'll have the damage of being too 'slow-paced' or some equally ridiculous excuse.

All I'm hoping for is that this work, this devving that was attained in like, what? Two weeks if it wasn't built out of outside code which even to someone like me who's got no experience is pretty fucking crazy; doesn't become moot because 'we don't like it'. I hope the server works on it without alienating those S2K loving crazies.

I don't agree with the stat thing personally, I get the 'it's a roleplaying game, like uh, D6 or DND!' but it's hardly ever been in that category involving numbers but moreso portraying a character in the environment (from my... 'enjoyable' formative years of S2RPing, lol), numerical advantages aren't exactly lauded since 2014 where cops had inherent synthetic advantages or something minuscule earlier in the years to give them a +10 in roll, when S2RP was done it was done with inherent 'play to lose' belief, which whilst impossible to a large server scale, was never sent to a numbers game in any of the servers cause, the fear?

Fear of super men running around kicking ass, or some dude taking a bullet to the noggin and still quick swapping around because they got DEX 10 and kicking your ass.

maybe I failed to add anything constructive and just rant by mistake, just feels like this system is gonna be the awkward middlechild hated by both s2rp wanters and s2k wanting, and I really do hope the server sticks with it to make it work, personally not with the numbers involved but, some form of fix for the 'stat disadvantage' doesn't plague us again.
 
PilotBland

Apart from throwing shade at me as you always have a habit of doing- that's a very good post you have there at least in regards to how this system could go completely wrong.

Often a justification for S2K is a sense of fairness that's not attained in either S2RP (especially P2L S2RP) or S2R(oll) since it gives no inherit advantage to any party beyond "extra armor" which can effectively be negated with a high FPS skill level and low ping. In this system we can potentially run into a issue where if this is not balanced correctly then we will run into the exact same issue as both P2L and S2R (with inherit advantages) where people will actively avoid characters with inherit advantages and following that: all combat circumstances. That in turn leaves it as you said: "the awkward middle child" where both sides of the S2RP/S2K argument hate it due to that general fear of potential character loss via effectively statistical advantages.

Unless we want this system to fail due to what is inherit statistical fear I feel that the following must be adhered to: "No character should ever be left in a completely unwinnable or inescapable circumstance unless they are either: A. Overwhelmed with a far larger number of individuals which can cover all possible exits, B. Deliberately disabled themselves through poor stat choices or C. Have been disabled in RP prior to the combat scenario".

If we cannot achieve a balance paradigm that prevents that fear then this system will fail.
 
Last edited:
PilotBland said:
Haha, alright guys. Take it easy now...

Everybody just *chill*.

I don't know if the vast majority of people advocating for S2... stat system turn based are gonna love it all too much. Knowing where I've met all these players at, except TheDeNuke he sucks, I feel like it'll have the damage of being too 'slow-paced' or some equally ridiculous excuse.

All I'm hoping for is that this work, this devving that was attained in like, what? Two weeks if it wasn't built out of outside code which even to someone like me who's got no experience is pretty fucking crazy; doesn't become moot because 'we don't like it'. I hope the server works on it without alienating those S2K loving crazies.

I don't agree with the stat thing personally, I get the 'it's a roleplaying game, like uh, D6 or DND!' but it's hardly ever been in that category involving numbers but moreso portraying a character in the environment (from my... 'enjoyable' formative years of S2RPing, lol), numerical advantages aren't exactly lauded since 2014 where cops had inherent synthetic advantages or something minuscule earlier in the years to give them a +10 in roll, when S2RP was done it was done with inherent 'play to lose' belief, which whilst impossible to a large server scale, was never sent to a numbers game in any of the servers cause, the fear?

Fear of super men running around kicking ass, or some dude taking a bullet to the noggin and still quick swapping around because they got DEX 10 and kicking your ass.

maybe I failed to add anything constructive and just rant by mistake, just feels like this system is gonna be the awkward middlechild hated by both s2rp wanters and s2k wanting, and I really do hope the server sticks with it to make it work, personally not with the numbers involved but, some form of fix for the 'stat disadvantage' doesn't plague us again.
Click to expand...
This is simply a balance issue and can be mended before the server starts or even after the server starts with updates.
 
You can shit on the idea all you want, but often times S2RP is just used as an excuse by both sides of conflict to try and squirm their way out of difficult situations that might result in their character dying or being captured. Fight RP is bad enough and we've seen plenty of examples of how badly that can go just based on "oh, well, if I hit you with this wrench you would have X reaction," and the other person responding "you don't know that, or no it would happen Y way" and repeating in a circle infinitely.

I continue to maintain that the system we have now, the turn-based combat one, is the closest to S2RP that we can possibly get without getting bogged down in player arguments, staff intervention, and general tedium. It just isn't possible for mid-sized or large communities to operate under primarily S2RP and still function decently. Added on top of the fact that it causes arguments, it takes forever as well, because when people aren't arguing in an infinite loop it drags out conflict to an unbelievably long extent.

TL;DR S2RP in all cases doesn't work and never will.
 
Sectus said:
You can shit on the idea all you want, but often times S2RP is just used as an excuse by both sides of conflict to try and squirm their way out of difficult situations that might result in their character dying or being captured. Fight RP is bad enough and we've seen plenty of examples of how badly that can go just based on "oh, well, if I hit you with this wrench you would have X reaction," and the other person responding "you don't know that, or no it would happen Y way" and repeating in a circle infinitely.

I continue to maintain that the system we have now, the turn-based combat one, is the closest to S2RP that we can possibly get without getting bogged down in player arguments, staff intervention, and general tedium. It just isn't possible for mid-sized or large communities to operate under primarily S2RP and still function decently. Added on top of the fact that it causes arguments, it takes forever as well, because when people aren't arguing in an infinite loop it drags out conflict to an unbelievably long extent.

TL;DR S2RP in all cases doesn't work and never will.
Click to expand...
yeah S2RP is difficult, but is it really worth throwing all IC things out the window because something is hard?

"It's getting too complicated and people are complaining in LOOC, guess my CSGO skills will come in handy today."

Nothing about S2K is real RP, playing your character becomes secondary in the FPS match that ensues, and FPS matches in a game & gamemode which is not meant for that kind of stuff, was your character skilled in combat? Does he have a trait that would be especially useful? Tough luck boss, better get that CSGO ready because you'll be practicing for a while my friend.

I don't get the appeal of S2K, it's as I said, just an arcade shooter, it's a system which is biased towards those who grew up playing shooters, and / or just naturally have good skill in it.

Getting good at S2K is, for some at least, pretty much impossible. How do you practice? If you try to S2K with the pros you'll get annihilated and won't learn anything, if you play other games like CSGO you'll still miss something, because the games, while in some ways similar, have pretty big differences, like stamina, screen blur, aim punch etc.

Tl;dr: S2K hardly works, it's not fair for those who are naturally shit at shooter games or don't have the time to invest into learning, and it'll probably never change.
 
Nick said:
yeah S2RP is difficult, but is it really worth throwing all IC things out the window because something is hard?

"It's getting too complicated and people are complaining in LOOC, guess my CSGO skills will come in handy today."

Nothing about S2K is real RP, playing your character becomes secondary in the FPS match that ensues, and FPS matches in a game & gamemode which is not meant for that kind of stuff, was your character skilled in combat? Does he have a trait that would be especially useful? Tough luck boss, better get that CSGO ready because you'll be practicing for a while my friend.

I don't get the appeal of S2K, it's as I said, just an arcade shooter, it's a system which is biased towards those who grew up playing shooters, and / or just naturally have good skill in it.

Getting good at S2K is, for some at least, pretty much impossible. How do you practice? If you try to S2K with the pros you'll get annihilated and won't learn anything, if you play other games like CSGO you'll still miss something, because the games, while in some ways similar, have pretty big differences, like stamina, screen blur, aim punch etc.

Tl;dr: S2K hardly works, it's not fair for those who are naturally shit at shooter games or don't have the time to invest into learning, and it'll probably never change.
Click to expand...
S2k is far from CSGO alike and s2k'ers must likely suck at CS aswell, it's just an unskilled strategy to rush, hold mouse 1 and wiggle from right to left and viceversa. in the clockwork days. Either way, I always felt it'd never fit in HL2RP.
 
Nick said:
yeah S2RP is difficult, but is it really worth throwing all IC things out the window because something is hard?

"It's getting too complicated and people are complaining in LOOC, guess my CSGO skills will come in handy today."

Nothing about S2K is real RP, playing your character becomes secondary in the FPS match that ensues, and FPS matches in a game & gamemode which is not meant for that kind of stuff, was your character skilled in combat? Does he have a trait that would be especially useful? Tough luck boss, better get that CSGO ready because you'll be practicing for a while my friend.

I don't get the appeal of S2K, it's as I said, just an arcade shooter, it's a system which is biased towards those who grew up playing shooters, and / or just naturally have good skill in it.

Getting good at S2K is, for some at least, pretty much impossible. How do you practice? If you try to S2K with the pros you'll get annihilated and won't learn anything, if you play other games like CSGO you'll still miss something, because the games, while in some ways similar, have pretty big differences, like stamina, screen blur, aim punch etc.

Tl;dr: S2K hardly works, it's not fair for those who are naturally shit at shooter games or don't have the time to invest into learning, and it'll probably never change.
Click to expand...
Agreed. The only situations I see S2K working in is in very large battles (10+ player combatants) with an outcome that doesn’t effect personal characters.
 
Nick said:
text
Click to expand...
Sacrifices have to be made for the greater good of the system. No, S2K isn't legitimate roleplay, but it's a sacrifice we make so that the RP in other areas can be high quality. It prevents pointless, endless arguments.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top